i can sleep soundly knowing that two of the largest brands that at least at one point made an effort to produce enthusiast cars at multiple price points is owned and operated by vindictive dickheads
speaking of things that are no longer in production the continental extremecontact sport02 in the 205/50r15 size is apparently no longer produced with no replacement planned
i was really looking forward to buying a set as they seemed to be the right combination of wet and dry grip with good feel and breakaway characteristics with some comparing them favourably to the michelin ps4
if anyone has any suggestions for a non 200tw tire in that size let me know
Wow I thought the options for 17s was slimming out, I went to check if my current go-to cheap but still good enough (Firestone Firehawk Indy 500, which is a rebadged Bridgestone RE003) tire was available in that size and you are shit out of luck. I used to run the Nitto NT05 on my Mazdaspeed3 in the summer and they were the best of the 200tw in the rain at the time. Take this with a grain of salt since that was over 10 years ago now, but they seem to still make them and they do come in that size.
while i did look at the 200tw tires i perhaps wrongly assumed theyd last 4000miles and turn into bricks the second it got chilly because some of them definitely are not 200tw based on how many runs some guys are getting out of them
I've been happy with the Firehawk Indy 500s that I got last year for my Fit. I was previously using Dunlop Direzzas, which I couldn't find in the size I wanted, and I haven't noticed any real drop off in performance (caveat: I don't track my car). My only complaint with the Firestones is that they're a bit noisy on the freeway.
I've solved them being noisy by putting them on a car with stiff mounts, and a loud exhaust. A 245/40/17 puts down 400+ftlbs of torque in a ~3klb car on the street better than expected. The only complaint I have with them is their name, key words coming, FOR THE MONEY I don't think there is a better street performance tire out there.
While Laguna Seca might be a better brand name for a performance handling tire, Firestone likely already has a deal with Indianapolis Motor Speedway to use the Indy 500 name and that still is the most famous race in America.
in 2021 i bought a car with 2017 date coded indy 500s that rode like absolute dogshit. it was coming from cali, so maybe the sun plus being a little old made them brittle. i replaced them with continental extremecontact dws 06s and it made a HUGE difference.
* gestures broadly at parts quality and dearth for classics *
It's becoming difficult to keep classics on the road with shit quality parts in the supply chain. I'm seeing a lot of stuff bad out of the box now and it's becoming a real problem.
I had to wait a long while for a new a/c pipes for my 2000 Boxster…because they (used to?) come from Russia, apparently. Didn’t stop them costing £325, which must buy mucho vodka. Chinesium vs Russomnium, compare and contrast?
I ordered a thermostat and housing, to save time scraping old gasket, for my the 5.8 in my bronco, pretty sure it's used the same one since the dawn of time and shares it with other 351/302 stuff. The housing that arrived was not even close to the quality of of the original, lacked some of the reliefs ect. In the casting, and didn't even fit the gasket supplied with it well. It looked like zinc.
Needless to say I scrapped the old gasket off and used the original housing.
I had a similar problem. I bought a roll of gasket material from the local heavy truck supply house and started cutting my own like I was working on a brass era coach built thing. My 5.8 is out of an 89 F250 and I put a set of alu heads and alu intake on it, but I needed a thermostat housing that pointed up to make the top hose work. I went through 3 before I got a decent one. I wound up having to use that waterpump/water neck rtv goop to get it to stop pissing.
One of my recent travails involved replacing the AC lines on one of my impalas. Picked up the CHYNA lines and thought they felt like paper mache. Went up in the attic and found an aftermarket set from about ten years ago that were noticeably heavier. Chabuduo right in the keister
Since I'm likely jumping into classics from late models (lots of pretty good parts for late models), can you recommend suppliers, or tell me which suppliers to stay away from? My go-to is Summit, and they're usually fantastic...
If you're going to stick with a certain brand or platform, comb the junkyard first and stock up on stuff that looks original and usable. From there it's a roll of the dice. Everything seems to come out of one giant red factory and goes into different boxes. I still get a lot of parts at Napa but that's because the staff is helpful and consistent and they have me on a pricing structure that usually beats the box parts stores.
Pretty much any subsidiary of the Holley Group is trash now. Edelbrock was purchased by a private investment group who also own the largest aluminum foundry kettle thing. Their quality has slipped significantly from when an Edelbrock family member was at the helm. Generally the stuff with a Scott Drake reproductions tag is bottom tier. There is a Chinesium parts supplier that changes its name every few years to outrun the review inertia: ProComp/Speedmaster/Etc. MSD ignition is pretty poor now. Pretty much all electronics from China, including alternators and voltage regulators, circuit breakers, switches, and buttons.
Production has narrowed significantly so that a handful of factories produce repop or replacement parts, and they just put them in different boxes. You can still find some old stock stuff if you buy old stuff off eBay, but you have to watch the hustlers who put new junk in NOS boxes. They'll do that with OEM parts too on eBay and at swap meets because most people don't know a $10 part from a $250 OEM new old stock piece.
It will not be uncommon for you to return/replace 1 or 2 for being out of spec, even with Summit. But Summit is great about returns. Beware any house brand Summit stuff. It's always been okay to middling, but it's getting worse just because suppliers are worse.
Usually you can sort on Summit for Made in USA stuff, which is how I find most of the bits I need via mail order. I also lay in a stock of replacement parts for routine maintenance like valve cover gaskets, water pumps, oil pumps, brake components, etc.
Buy as much used OE stuff as you can and beware buying a classic that's been restored with "all new parts" because they took really good stuff and replaced it with shiny garbage that's 1/3 the quality.
really disheartening to see how badly the quality has fallen
ive heard too many tales of speedmaster/procomp head falt out not working out of the box with valves getting stuck in the guides and seats not being concentric and whatnot
if youre willing to check each head over and have it remachined if necessary they arent a bad deal if youre okay with china heads
The good news is if you can afford to buy good performance parts you can still get them. AFR, Meier, Mustangs to Fear, Rose Hill, and others still make good stuff. Mustang Steve still does brake stuff. NPD tends to have pretty good repop quality parts. Branda too. West Coast Classic Cougar has some Dynacorn stuff they've brought to market they're happy with, which says a lot. Even American based Pertronix has their stuff made in China, but it's a notch better than the bottom tier Vatozone stuff. I run one of their ignition boxes that's been really good quality.
I bought Rose Hill adjustable strut rods for my car like 2 years ago and they were fantastic. And they're just a small shop in Texas building stuff one piece at a time.
It's the middle class being squeezed who still want to build hot rods or classics and can't really afford to who are being catered to with cheapo go fast parts. The guys with Cobras and Shelbys can still buy all the good stuff they want. So, this is really a gulf broadening between people who can afford it and people who really can't. anymore but haven't yet been able to admit it to themselves. And Speedmaster has cleverly found a place in that niche, especially when people got those stimmy checks.
But we're all being screwed over by the pedestrian bits that are being built to lowest standard and hobbling all the classics. Even the guys with GT40s or Panteras can't escape distributor caps and plug wires made of the finest Wuhan cheeses.
I breathe a sigh of relief every time I buy something from Napa and see that it was made in Mexico. How far we've slid when that seems like something to celebrate over the true shit that does its long march from China
Most of what I mean with "supply chain issues" is that a lot of stuff is filtering down from Covid era and just after. A lot of manufacturers figured out they can sell just as much shit quality as meh quality and pay half the wages.
However, there has been a significant drop in quality of cast parts over the last 6-10 years. IDKWTF is going on with that, but I've had brake drums shatter when barely dropped as a new normal.
Interesting analysis. Could you explain about cyber security and why it means no more gas 718s in Europe? I’m down to one car and it wouldn’t know what to do with a modem if it had one, so I don’t understand WTF “cyber security” has to do with a modern sports car.
“ A new cybersecurity regulation, UNECE R 155, comes from the United Nations and requires carmakers…”
This sentence makes my brain explode. Fuck the UN and fuck Porsche and anyone else for kowtowing to them. I took a giant UN regulation in my toilet this AM before I got in the shower.
Just to be clear…the ruling itself is not killing off the vehicles. It’s the fact that the micro and possibly other ICs need to be replaced, which means new SW, integration, validation, etc., (at both the module and vehicle level) which can run to the millions of dollars, per module.This is part of what is driving SDV (software defined vehicles) EE architectures.
Yeah, not sure what it has to do with cyber security, since it just creates a bigger attack surface. Unless they'll make us subscribe to an janky version of "Norton For Cars" as well... (don't laugh)
As for wifi/remote capability, I have no love for Teslas, but I do like how my friend can "pre-A/C" his MY from wherever we are, so it's cool by the time we get it. Spoiled and bougie? Sure. But it's been like Saigon here lately.
My Jeep would do that with remote start from a reasonable distance away. I’d click it from my 2nd floor office, and by the time I’d thrown my laptop in my bag, stopped to pee, and walked out the front door the Jeep would be ice cold (or toasty warm), no intrusive electronics needed.
I won't lie, I pay for OnStar just to have this feature. I never have to step in a hot/cold car if I don't want to. Worth the $40/month, and I hate needless tech.
Or the actual police show up because your city has an ordinance against leaving ICE cars and trucks idling.
In Michigan it's illegal to leave an unattended car running on public roads, private roads, and parking lots. Until the law was changed 7 years ago, it was technically illegal to warm up or cool down your car on your own driveway. In 2017, some guy in Roseville got a $128 ticket for warming up his car on his driveway, and the resulting furor forced the politicians/bureaucrats to change the law.
I pay for the phone-based remote start as well. As long as I stay away from the “rate your driving and save on ur insurance (yeah, right), I should be good!
I should have a burning desire to own a Porsche. As a child of the seventies and the days before cable & VHS, I saw McQueen in Le Mans on the big screen twice per year during elementary school via community “movie night” programs. But nearing retirement and the opening of the Retirement Account vaults I find the only vaguely attractive hyper car to be the 2nd gen NSX.
So it is true. I saw the usual circle jerk groups on Facebook bellowing loudly that Porsche "gets it". Honestly, I can't wait for the whole EV thing to collapse. I'm tried of reading self indulgent "car people" bemoan dinosaur ICE vehicles and the stupid people that drive them. Shit, Fords CEO made a plea for people to buy EV's and small cars again.
I had a 2014 Ford Taurus with the 2.0 Ecoboost. Honestly, I loved that car. Ford I thought was doing a good job, better than GM on that front but all the same they threw in the towel and said "we can't do it!"
It’s just that it’s frustrating that all these automakers are just selling themselves out by producing the lowest common denominator product possible, when even a decade ago, they prided themselves on being the best! Honda made a midsize family sedan that giddyupped and cornered better than anything else in the class, and now they’re satisfied with peddling something that barely runs away from a PRIUS, much less a Camry!
Of course BMW lost the plot fifteen years ago, and Mercedes, which built cars to a standard, now peddles glorified golf carts that are barely better than the Chinese junk!
My crystal ball is extremely fallible, but we ARE talking about the company that used to charge an extra eight grand to NOT provide a convertible top and which charged $200k extra to NOT have a wing on a 911GT3-Minus, er, 911R.
Well you and I may not fall for it, but clearly a whole bunch of boomer fucks paid em good money for that gimmickry, so are we really right to bitch about it?
Yeah, and you and I are probably physically capable enough to kill any woman in America with our bare hands*. Would we be right to take advantage of people as a result?
* based on the fact that I probably am, and you wouldn't make things any worse :)
The decision is cynical, crass and craven. Aka "Very Porsche" (tm)
It could also be a reasonable hedge if there's an econ event that actually does freak out the 1% (though, I fine those harder to imagine these days) and there's an auto bailout that's kinda-sorta prorated on an OEM's green-ness. We saw versions of that in 2008, after all.
I remember reading the original C&D review of the 944 Turbo S and - baked into my mind as much as the actual review - was the paragraph on how close Porsche was bankruptcy in post-1987 recession. They moved something like 14k cars annually in the early 90's. Those are Alfa numbers!
I think Singers just don’t look right with their mash-up designs, but you have to hand it to them for separating even more money from wealthy people than even Porsche does. And they did it just by following the logic of the Porsche option list, which is more destructive to a rich person’s brain than a parasite. Singer just amped up the option list to levels that probably made Porsche jealous, and it was catnip to the 1%.
i kinda like options lists--at least porsche'd done it. as the first honda car dealer in oklahoma i got no notice when i asked honda to offer more options/deletes.
I HIGHLY recommend this podcast in which Hannah Elliott and a Bloomberg Bug Man talk to Tom Wagner about his investment in Singer. He gives a lot of info on the biz.
I would just *love* to know what series of myopic board room meetings led to GM and Cadillac green-lighting the Celestiq. Were they just chomping at the bit to get back to their pre-Sloanian "Standard of the World" days, and only thought they could justify it with an EV? Did they think an EV flagship would actually solidify the idea that EVs are luxury items and sell more Lyriqs and Optiqs and Escalade IQs (at a loss)? Did they just really want to capture a slice of the market of people who put 1,000 miles on a car a year?
Someone please inform me, because I can't think of a single good business case for the Celestiq, and I'm pretty imaginative. I also can't think of who would buy one, other than whichever Hollywood A-lister they've paid-off to be a brand ambassador for it.
I imagine the Celestiq would actually be a whole lot more relevant and desirable if it had one of GM's spectacular V8 engines. Hell, they could throw in a supercharged LS block, not unlike the one in the current Escalade V, or even the short-lived Blackwing V8 that was only used in the CT6-V and CT6 4.2 Twin-Turbo Platinum. Sadly, GM seems content to erase all of its excellent engineering history making cars that people wanted and still want, in favor of cars that it has to convince people they want.
BMW is doing the same thing with its current styling: working its damndest to erase any semblance of its classically balanced design or even the basic brand hallmarks. The current 5 Series looks like it could have been designed by anybody; there's nothing "BMW" about it. And so is Porsche, which is trying to disavow the history of entry-level cars that were genuinely good, in spite of how deliberately kneecapped they were.
It seems like all of these companies are apologizing for the great achievements of their past, and committing to making the future a lot less fun. Witness Mercedes: "We're sorry we once put a stonking 6.2-liter V8 in a car the size of a matchbox. Here, have this high-strung turbocharged electrified 4-cylinder wearing the same AMG 63 badge, instead!"
Meanwhile, I'm sorely tempted to buy a 2024 ES 350 Ultra Luxury. It's roomy, extremely comfortable, has lovely materials you don't get in cars costing twice as much, and has a naturally-aspirated V6 without hybridization *or* stop/start. And it'll last forever, if reasonably cared for. I have the S 550 Coupe, but an ES 350 makes a better--and more cost-effective--daily. And won't need preserving, while allowing me to preserve the S 550 Coupe.
I recently acquired a 2005 LS430 from a friend that makes financially ruinous decisions. It was on short money.
The plan was to send it on at 2x what I paid him, but we like the car more than expected. At 175k miles, I think it'll outlast any 2024 model car from any maker or price.
Man, do I not need reminding of my gem of an '06 LS430. Seems like forever ago, but it's only been a year, but that's life. It was not the decision (to sell) that I wanted to make, but it wasn't a bad decision. They are phenomenal cars. The engineers were actually given a decent budget to work with and they put those funds to good use.
The EV flagship thing is not a completely horrible idea, particularly for sales out here on the left coast. BUT, the idea that it should be almost as butt ugly as an Aztec is beyond unbelievable. How can they make such beautiful concept cars and such ugly bland productions cars? (yes, I knw, f***ing MBA types). WTF could they have not dropped the Ciel body onto the Ultium platform???
I happen to like the Celestiq's styling, but it's controversial, for sure. If it were effortlessly gorgeous or even as handsome as, say, a Rolls-Royce Spectre, a lot of people could forgive the fact that it's an EV.
I fully endorse the purchase of an ES350 from any gen. Drove an 09 for the better part of a year and it was wonderful. Had a 2024 as a loaner while my NX was in the shop and it was excellent. Apparently you have to be able to fold a paper crane using only your non dominant hand to work the line for the ES. Sounds like some straight Miyagi shit and I'm all for it.
1. Joe Biden said we have to do nothing but electrics from now on. He has barrels full of Chinese cash to sweeten the pot. Since Americans are ignorant sheep, they'll realize they have no choice and will beat down our doors to buy (lease) the latest and greatest.
- Isn't he a corrupt, senile old man?
- - That's ageist and smacks of colonialism. You're fired.
- Electric cars suck and we don't have the infrastructure to support it
- - You hate Mother Earth and your reflexive defense smacks of deep seated hatred. You too are fired!
2. Heritage doesn't sell cars. Everyone who matters want electric cars. CNN confirms this.
- I think our most loyal customers love their LS powered Silverados, Tahoes and Vettes. I don't think they'll make the transition. Don't we trot out commercials every Christmas season featuring some of our classic Chevy models with elderly white veterans pining for the America they lost and trying to remember it with a small block?
- - Listen you backwoods hillbilly piece of shit. I'm Mary, f-u-c-k-i-n-g Barra. I fought in the cutthroat trenches of HR and I know the likes of you wouldn't last five seconds in a fight with a woman like my good friend Rachel Levine. What makes you think a real woman like me is going to stand for your bullshit. Oh Hector, Ravindra and Mohammed - come in here and haul this honky piece of shit to the grave along with Harley Earl, Alfred Sloan and Bill Mitchell. Girl Power!
3. Come on carbon based forms of life with lived experiences. Let's get with the program and come up with some bold, dynamic ideas!
- How about we come out with an ultra exclusive electric Cadillac that will show the world that GM is all about corporate responsibility who is deeply invested in the new economy and effective stewardship of our collective resources. We'll price it so the knuckle draggers that can't see past their MAGA flags don't spoil the broth.
-- Do you hate Israel too? How do you look in a dress? You have VP written all over you
I know I've stated that I like the Cadillac EV's styling direction, but have always had, silently, some reservation for the Celestiq's tail light design. Well, their "Bespoke" advertisement with that childish orange color and real-world driving [animation] [of the rear turn signals/brake lights particularly] confirmed the worst can-I-drink-her-pretty fears. Ugh.
This generation of ES is a sharp-looking one, and does a better job at looking proportionate, upscale, and of presence than the offroad-prerunner-front-wheel-fender-gap current-gen LS. A shame. And GS is long gone. I loved the GS line.
BMW "styling" is horrendous right now. I wish I could be that rich and that dumb (and blind) to buy one and be happy with it. Inversion is in with, well, literally everything now, so it's not surprising in that respect. Time to dream of E46 ZHP sedans again..
"Golf carts?" Even if you are (as I fully believe you are) completely unprepared ever to admit that an EV could be a fun car to drive, surely you can find less tired insults than that.
They are. I've driven plenty of Volvo EV's including Polestars that came in. Who doesn't smile with the low end torque. The issue is the culture. They were billed as earth saving, no maintenance, no nothing next wave of the future. They're anything but that.
As soon as an EV has a dynamic envelope equivalent to its ICE counterpart, I'll shut my mouth. For real. Radical has been doing EV prototypes. When they do SR8 laptimes with the same corner speeds, that will settle it for me. But I think you'll need some magic batteries.
That being said, how is the EV experience NOT golf-carty?
(As opposed to Sharon Silke Carty.)
You switch it on and nothing happens. You press the pedal and it whirs. There's no discernible character in the acceleration other than "less of it as you leave zero rpm".
If you're looking for no sacrifice in ultimate capability (in areas other than acceleration) then ICE cars will continue to win for the moment just based on lower weight. But, especially for those of us who don't spend time on tracks, "wider dynamic envelope" and "more fun" don't always go together at all.
And I think by "character in the acceleration" you mean "character in the noise." Or maybe "holes in the acceleration curve from peaky powerbands." Personally, the thing I get from EVs that I miss in the ICE cars is instant powertrain response. The fact that the acceleration is very linear is also a feature, not a bug. For me, the entertainment advantages of ICEs are limited at this point to the noise and, where present, the manual transmission.
Instant response is what motorcycles and low mass flywheels are for.
Anyway, the general sense for EVs is that they are lifeless and dull. They don't have the character, or flaws, that make a machine feel alive to a human. For some, that is worth the tradeoff. For others - those who want a commuter appliance - it isn't.
EVs aren't the panacea they're constantly sold as. They're not that great environmentally, they still require maintenance, their weight means chewing through tires, & etc.
Jack is sometimes hyperbolic and I assume it is purposeful.
It might be the noise but there is definitely something blocking my ability to have fun driving an EV.
I drove a nonGT version of an EV6 AWD for a few days. It was quiet, smooth, comfortable, and efficient (especially in city driving) but I never really *enjoyed* driving it even though its acceleration was somewhere between my Stinger and Charger.
Maybe a convertible EV would do something for me? I don't expect I'll like the fakery of things like the Ioniq5 N. Most likely scenario for me in an EV market takeover is I have a plug-in commuter car and then some hossed -up ICE pleasure car(s).
The noise is a big part of it, but it's so much more: the lack of revs, shifting, or anything at all for the driver to do, really. They're also boring to think/talk about because they're all mechanically identical, regardless of brand or country of origin. AND you can't work on them yourself or modify them unless you pay the manufacturer for some lame over the air software update.
Basically driving good ICE is like sex and the best an EV can offer is a silent poronographic movie. They might get you to the same place (maybe sometimes even faster), but all of the intimacy, engagement, and joy are notably absent.
the best thing about a good NA ICE is the sound (not noise) as the revs build to a crescendo, especially if paired with a manual transmission (which requires skill to rev match). No EV will ever match that.
You will hear people describe Lace Alumitones, which have a broader and flatter frequency response than conventional guitar pickups, as sounding "sterile" or "hifi", but is that just because people are used to hearing the midrange bump of conventional pickups?
If we all grew up driving glorified golf carts, we might think of that as the normal "character" of motor vehicles.
I think the color in chemical photography is more "real" than digital, but I'm willing to accept that's because that's what my brain was trained on.
I still think it's a stupid use of resources to use vehicles that weigh 25-50% more than a similar ICE vehicle, besides the fact that we don't have the grid for EVs. That being said, in some cases, like last mile delivery or taxis, EVs might make sense.
EVs are great as commuters, especially in stop and go traffic. No engine vibrations means a "chiller" experience. I really enjoyed my C-max just for that reason alone.
I'm getting into my car (shitty, overpriced 2022 turbo-4 Boxster S that I drove 850 miles to Maine) after getting some nice Atlantic salmon. A young man, maybe 25, stops me and says "I've always wanted a Porsche, that's my favorite brand, and one day I'll get one!"
His girlfriend laughs and says " not at the rate you're going" just as I tell him "I'm sure you will."
A couple points to your article:
I'm pretty sure Porsche doesn't hate me. I've bought two new mid engined cars from them in the past eight years. Price wise there isn't a $30-$50,000 gap between my high spec 991 and 718 and the non-S 911. It's much more of a price continuation. High spec 718s run into the $140,000 range.
The average 40 year old first time Porsche sports car buyer doesn't know anything about pre VW Porsche. The 50-70 year old Porsche buyer doesn't care about that old stuff, the cars today are a world different from the 993 or 996 or early Boxsters.
Not everyone feels a need to buy the most expensive 911 they can afford, trust me. Many guys I know have both 911s and Boxsters or Caymans. They aren't interchangeable or exclusive of one another.
It is entirely possible to both know you are being cynically manipulated by a car brand AND enjoy its products, especially since you also know your resale value is likely to be very high.
"It is entirely possible to both know you are being cynically manipulated by a car brand AND enjoy its products'
I mean, this is literally the Apple playbook lol.
Speaking of which, I'm currently sitting in my empty Alfa/Maser dealer for service and I can't help but think the brands would better served by setting up shop Apple Store-style in high-end malls.
Lotus has their Paris showroom in a high end district next to luxury boutiques. Very practical experience and significantly easier to get close to the car without having to go into some district far outside the city. Especially for brands with few models this approach would make sense. On a side note, I genuinely don’t understand the obsession of American dealers to have 100s of new cars on the lot, instead of just allowing customers to order specific configurations.
The Manhattan and Bev Hills "flagship" dealers are more like that. I think MB of Manhattan might even be operated by MB of NA. I think Jack had a piece a long time ago about how the dealers were the customers not the public, so even though we hate the dealer world, the OEMs actually like having a retail-level dog to kick when they need to (vs owning the retail-level headaches).
I think a hybrid approach could work for a niche maker like Alfa/Maser. A handful of OEM-run flagship stores in major cities and upscale malls, and leave the existing dealers (which are dying off anyway) in place. Like how, for an iphone, you can go to the Apple Store, but also go to a franchised Verizon store... or some 3rd party electronics shop as well.
We lost our Alfa and Maserati dealers here in OKC. The Alfa Romeo and Fiat dealer became the used Hyundai building, then Genesis, and now Genesis has launched its own standalone store across the street, and the building is likely to be torn down for extra lot space on the Hyundai side.
Our Maserati dealer was also Jaguar and Land Rover (actually, prior to this, it was Land Rover, Saturn, Saab and Hummer)…but they just tore down the building and made a new one, and very deliberately left Maserati out. I think there’s one master tech who works on the Maseratis.
At some point, I'd love to read something on why the Germans succeeded in America and the other Euros didn't.
My hunch is that is has to do with industrial policy. That is, the Germans had fewer labor issues, therefore didn't have the infamous quality issues of French and Italian cars, which in turn made relations with US dealers less strained. And the dealer experience is massively important to success in the US.
The Japanese, I assume, succeeded purely through the right-product-right-time (and also having few labor surprises) in the 1970s. And the Koreans by being cheap and reliable (enough) to stomach the dealers.
EDIT: my "like" here is purely appreciation for the local info; if there was a "like, but I hate the news", I'd click it.
"It is entirely possible to both know you are being cynically manipulated by a car brand AND enjoy its products, especially since you also know your resale value is likely to be very high."
Malcolm Bricklin got into the car business trying to import Subarus to Israel after first hooking up with them importing Subaru Rabbit scooters to the U.S.
Name an automaker that hasn’t “lost their way”. I’ll wait…
The two that come the closest, in my opinion:
Toyota (still has a manual available in a truck and has the GR— with Toyoda saying EV’s are not necessarily the answer) and Mazda (Miata and some fun to drive stuff up and down the line up).
All car companies have abandoned their core personalities searching for market share. As the differences wane, so does brand enthusiasm.
Hey now, this is avoidable contact, so we MUST piss on Porsche every chance we can get. Clearly they're the WORST, and Frod (because they once employed the Baruth brothers in one capacity or another) can do no wrong, and GM is a bunch of losers except for the plastic corvettes, which are the best, blah blah...
Anything to stray from the goddamn formula of what to like and what to dislike would run afoul of people having a brain and wanting to decide for themselves.
"Anything to stray from the goddamn formula of what to like and what to dislike would run afoul of people having a brain and wanting to decide for themselves."
To the contrary, that's what I'm here to encourage. And unlike the competition, I don't try to mask my opinions behind a veneer of "everyone thinks" or "experts say".
Just for clarity, I worked for Ford Credit, and I worked for a Ford dealership. I have never been a direct employee of any automaker. I also worked for BMW Credit, and for Honda, both as a contractor, in addition to selling Infinitis during 1994.
I will ABSOLUTELY piss on Porsche every chance I get. Even if it's TOO strident. Someone has to balance the bought-and-paid-for Porsche PR masquerading as autowriting elsewhere.
This would be fair to us if we were consuming the drivel from elsewhere. I don't even read much else auto related these days which is why this seems unnecessary to me.
It's like the feminists who like to remind you every 30 minutes not to rape.
This is fair and I'll keep it in mind. This publication should, as a rule, gratify the people who use it the most, not always be a counter to what else is out there.
A lot of women apparently feel safer with a bear in the woods than with a man they don't know. If you ask them what percentage of men would attack them, they'll say stuff like 50%. They have been indoctrinated to believe that most men are monsters.
That perplexes the 99% of men who don't think that rapists and pimps are role models.
I suppose the corresponding question for men would be, which is more likely to falsely accuse you of misconduct or entrap you with paternity fraud, a bear, or a woman?
I'd still rather come across a brunette than a bruin.
You may be conflating the percentage of "men in general" with "men that women choose."
When Nichole (age 18) began dating OJ Simpson, he was still married to Marguerite who was pregnant with his daughter, and, on the very first date, she returned with ripped jeans due to OJ's attempt to get inside them. So, NATURALLY, she decided to keep seeing him again and ultimately marry. Whereupon he was chronically verbally, emotionally, and physically abusive and chronically unfaithful.
It would be interesting to interview some of the men who saw her working at The Daisy and were unceremoniously rejected.
Had to look up what the f’ TIL is. Can we please just use English? (Cranky today- more than usual. Always old and out of touch.) Sorry, I shouldn’t hammer a fellow motorcycle racing aficionado. I’m ashamed.
Anyway, the 6 has been dead to me for years— since they stopped offering the manual. Maybe 2018?
But the Crown is relatively low-volume, and couldn’t possibly sell worse than the Avalon did. If anything, it’s a compelling product, especially for older people who don’t necessarily want to crawl into a traditional sedan anymore. I’m reminded of the Ford D3 cars (Five-Hundred, Montego, Taurus, Sable, MKS, Flex), which had quite tall H-points for what they were and sat a good half a foot taller than other sedans.
And the Tundra is a Toyota truck. The Tundra stopped being competitive a long time ago (I’d say around 2014 at the latest) and yet people continued to make excuses for it. They’ll make excuses for the new one, too…even if it tends to grenade engines. All Toyota really needed to do was not upset its fanbase, and it mostly hasn’t. Toyota doesn’t really need to chase sales from the (far-superior, IMO) Detroit half-tons.
But the core Toyota products: the RAV4, the Grand Highlander, the Corolla, the Prius, the Camry, the Sienna…those, they seem to be getting quite right, at least in all the ways that matter.
What pisses me off about Toyota—and I think it has definitely forsaken its customer base here—is that it the pandemic taught the company to deliberately constrain inventory on its hybrids, in order to keep transaction prices high and incentives low. And it’s one thing when Porsche does it, but Toyotas are supposed to be reasonably accessible to the general public. Someone shouldn’t have to be on a waiting list for two years to get a mid-level Sienna XLE. And I checked recently on national Prius inventory, to find that there were only 600-odd listed online, and a good portion of those were incoming units that hadn’t yet been built or delivered to their final stores.
I've yet to actually see a Crown in the wild here in central Kansas. I presume they've moved a few in larger metros. Do you see them on OKC? The higher H-point is well taken. My 83 year old mother prefers getting in and out of our Ford Maverick way more than the Porsches, Fiats, Alfa Romeos or BMWs around here.
As for the Tundra, I agree that the "people who don't actually need a truck" crowd are probably well served with the new model (if it doesn't grenade). The people who do need a truck are not buying them. The previous generation was not competitive feature wise but was basically un-killable despite the minimal maintenance and ranchers beating the living daylights out of the things. The new ones just aren't up to the task at hand and many dealers won't take them on trade so they're stuck. The whole thing seems very un-Toyota like.
Hopefully the GDI turbo hybrid setup in the Tacoma, 4 Runner and Land Cruiser is better sorted.
On availability...can you blame them? The entire industry relished in availability constrained profits of the pandemic. They all vowed not to return the the overproduction of pre-pandemic. Ford was only going to allow a handful of stock configurations, and everything else was to be an order. Now we're post-pandemic and only Honda and Toyota are able to learn anything. Between UAW contracts and a complete lack of discipline the market is flooded again.
Even the best companies make mistakes. But unlike other companies, Toyota has a habit of going to extraordinary lengths to do right by their customers. (e.g. rusted frame Tundra buyback).
Heck, Lexus once had a problem with dashboards in the early noughties and they offered to replace the dash on every defective car on three different models for three model years. I've never heard of a company that went that far.
I wonder what Colin Chapman would say about Lotus today. Though when he ran Lotus himself, he was not adverse to making bigger, heavier, more luxurious cars as the company grew. There was a four door executive sedan on the drawing board (the Chapman family car was a 450S Merc) when he died.
Well, as a traditionalist old guy that has a hard time finding anything current mildly interesting; I want to believe he would hate the direction it’s heading. I certainly do. Especially the Chinese ownership.
And yes, I did want “current” read in the above sentence as “recent vintage” and a reference to EVs.
Very much the same has happened with my beloved Aston Martin (1913-2000 RIP). The current Aston Martin literally has nothing to do with the company I fell in love with as a child. They were lousy cars, but great experiences. You are hard pressed to find a classic Aston with more than 25,000 miles on it, because issues were not uncommon. But, in quality of craftsmanship, they were unlike anything else on the road.
Then failed Porsche, BMW and Daewoo (!) exec Ulrich Bez took over and decided to turn Aston into a higher priced, lower quality Porsche copy. He pissed all over the Aston heritage, naming conventions, etc, and got rid of the craftsmanship that made Aston unique. Of course, Aston has crashed from financial disaster to disaster since he “recreated” it. And in a show of ego that must even impress the ranks of exotic car executives, he had the temerity to name his autobiography of his Aston years “Making Aston Martin”. You arrogant prick. Aston was made by the giants on whose shoulders you stood. And if that wasn’t enough, he charged the better part of $500 for it. It’s sad to watch the great marques fall one by one.
I don’t think there’s any market for the sorts of flawed hand built cars the British were known for making. Jaguar, Aston Martin, Land Rover, Bentley and Rolls-Royce would probably no longer be here if they hadn’t been absorbed by larger firms.
At least Aston Martin isn’t MG, which is basically a Chinese car brand with a storied name.
And while I won't buy one, it seems to me that an EV sports car makes a hell of a lot more sense than an EV anything else. How do people drive sports cars? A time or two a week, Sunday morning, Cars and Coffee, 20-50 mile twisty run. No range anxiety, fast acceleration, convertible, why shouldn't that be enough?
I used to think Porsche wouldn't sell more than a handful of them, now I'm not so sure.
True, unless the driver in question has never driven anything that turns well. In that case it just needs to turn better than the rest of the two ton EVs to seem amazing.
This explains why Tesla owners often rave about their car's handling... because they are coming directly from their parents' hand-me-down minivans, or public transportation!
This is the point you always miss. They DONT have to turn. They only have to LOOK like they can turn. Only the 1 percent that ever drives a Vette or a Porsche or what have you ever go fast enough to make real turning matter. For the rest, all Porsche has to do is put idiots like Farah or Lieberman in an EV sports car for 20 minutes to shoot their video and it's all good.
I think that even a normie can tell the difference between a Boxster 3.2 and a Boxster EV in slightly vigorous daily use. Especially if they have years in the former.
A few years ago, Sam Smith and I ran a GT4 Cayman against a Shelby GT500 around NCM West, which is very much a short track. Laptimes were identical, although accomplished in different ways. The nice thing about a Cayman is that it out-turns a 911 or a ponycar. Against a Corvette... well, we all have our limitations.
Every time I switch between winter and summer tires I'm reminded of how different tires can affect the overall character of a car. Summer tires are 205/50 vs 185/55 OEMs. Speedo is within 1% of stock.
On the Mustang forums whenever anyone is talking about going to or increasing an already staggered set up my eyes just start rolling involuntarily. Of course some of those guys have legit drag cars, in which case you may as well go barely street legal depending on your class, and if it's just for show then go nuts, but some of them actually think the car oversteers from the factory.
In the spirit of sta ying between the lines we should talk about cars as delivered from the factory.
I could personally fix a lot of stuff to make a car drive like it should, but do hold the maker accountable for not doing the work or pinching pennies.
not a fan of when oems put skinny tires at the front even on mid engined cars especially when theres so much room and it can keep you from overheating them
If you aren’t road tripping your sports car you’re doing it wrong.
I’m still trying to decide if I should take my bucket list Route 66 road trip in my S2000, or if I should buy a Corvette (which one???) and do it the right way.
You're not wrong, I drove the Boxster 850 miles from Michigan to Maine this spring.
Yesterday I not only saw an S2000 in a supermarket parking lot but an Acura NSX, the original one, on the the same day. What are those odds? Maine is a funny place for cars.
Didn't know that. I've never taken a close look at a convertible. If that's the case, then go with the convertible and don't worry about where to store the targa top.
I did 4700 miles from Minneapolis to Laguna Seca in May for the IMSA weekend, then south through the national parks and home. My buddy was in his Miata and I was the "support vehicle" in my Toyota 86.
I think this post duplicated itself
i can sleep soundly knowing that two of the largest brands that at least at one point made an effort to produce enthusiast cars at multiple price points is owned and operated by vindictive dickheads
speaking of things that are no longer in production the continental extremecontact sport02 in the 205/50r15 size is apparently no longer produced with no replacement planned
i was really looking forward to buying a set as they seemed to be the right combination of wet and dry grip with good feel and breakaway characteristics with some comparing them favourably to the michelin ps4
if anyone has any suggestions for a non 200tw tire in that size let me know
Wow I thought the options for 17s was slimming out, I went to check if my current go-to cheap but still good enough (Firestone Firehawk Indy 500, which is a rebadged Bridgestone RE003) tire was available in that size and you are shit out of luck. I used to run the Nitto NT05 on my Mazdaspeed3 in the summer and they were the best of the 200tw in the rain at the time. Take this with a grain of salt since that was over 10 years ago now, but they seem to still make them and they do come in that size.
RE-71RS or bust!
while i did look at the 200tw tires i perhaps wrongly assumed theyd last 4000miles and turn into bricks the second it got chilly because some of them definitely are not 200tw based on how many runs some guys are getting out of them
I've been happy with the Firehawk Indy 500s that I got last year for my Fit. I was previously using Dunlop Direzzas, which I couldn't find in the size I wanted, and I haven't noticed any real drop off in performance (caveat: I don't track my car). My only complaint with the Firestones is that they're a bit noisy on the freeway.
I've solved them being noisy by putting them on a car with stiff mounts, and a loud exhaust. A 245/40/17 puts down 400+ftlbs of torque in a ~3klb car on the street better than expected. The only complaint I have with them is their name, key words coming, FOR THE MONEY I don't think there is a better street performance tire out there.
While Laguna Seca might be a better brand name for a performance handling tire, Firestone likely already has a deal with Indianapolis Motor Speedway to use the Indy 500 name and that still is the most famous race in America.
cant wait for the bfg nelson lodges
shut up and take my money!
in 2021 i bought a car with 2017 date coded indy 500s that rode like absolute dogshit. it was coming from cali, so maybe the sun plus being a little old made them brittle. i replaced them with continental extremecontact dws 06s and it made a HUGE difference.
You don’t track your Fit? No shit!
I get motion sickness driving go-carts, and that was before I started having issues with vertigo (BPPV).
You know about the Epley maneuver videos correct?
Yes, I'm just hoping that the Epley maneuver continues to work.
My decision to start hunting for a 1st-gen Mustang just keeps looking better and better...
Yup, the Cubans were just ahead of us in terms of endlessly repairing old ICE vehicles.
I call it the "Cuban Slide." Because "When The World Is Running Down, You Make The Best Of What's Still Around."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mG4PRAONVKI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YC8vxXC0UMc
I won't buy it - it's Electric! Boogie woogie woogie
I won't drive it - it's Electric! Boogie woogie woogie
Ooh, it's lousy! It's Electric! Boogie woogie woogie
Are you coming with me?
Come, let me drive you in my old-school ride
If it breaks down, I'll fix it! Myself!
And I'll teach you the Cuban Slide!
* gestures broadly at parts quality and dearth for classics *
It's becoming difficult to keep classics on the road with shit quality parts in the supply chain. I'm seeing a lot of stuff bad out of the box now and it's becoming a real problem.
Accurate. My three runners are 28-30 years old and the mnfrs I used to be able to count on are no longer totally reliable.
On a long enough timeline, all cars become AutoZone Chinesium.
Every time I get a Delco part labeled “made in (CHYNA)”my lips get a little closer to Xi’s loafers
I had to wait a long while for a new a/c pipes for my 2000 Boxster…because they (used to?) come from Russia, apparently. Didn’t stop them costing £325, which must buy mucho vodka. Chinesium vs Russomnium, compare and contrast?
I ordered a thermostat and housing, to save time scraping old gasket, for my the 5.8 in my bronco, pretty sure it's used the same one since the dawn of time and shares it with other 351/302 stuff. The housing that arrived was not even close to the quality of of the original, lacked some of the reliefs ect. In the casting, and didn't even fit the gasket supplied with it well. It looked like zinc.
Needless to say I scrapped the old gasket off and used the original housing.
I had a similar problem. I bought a roll of gasket material from the local heavy truck supply house and started cutting my own like I was working on a brass era coach built thing. My 5.8 is out of an 89 F250 and I put a set of alu heads and alu intake on it, but I needed a thermostat housing that pointed up to make the top hose work. I went through 3 before I got a decent one. I wound up having to use that waterpump/water neck rtv goop to get it to stop pissing.
One of my recent travails involved replacing the AC lines on one of my impalas. Picked up the CHYNA lines and thought they felt like paper mache. Went up in the attic and found an aftermarket set from about ten years ago that were noticeably heavier. Chabuduo right in the keister
Since I'm likely jumping into classics from late models (lots of pretty good parts for late models), can you recommend suppliers, or tell me which suppliers to stay away from? My go-to is Summit, and they're usually fantastic...
If you're going to stick with a certain brand or platform, comb the junkyard first and stock up on stuff that looks original and usable. From there it's a roll of the dice. Everything seems to come out of one giant red factory and goes into different boxes. I still get a lot of parts at Napa but that's because the staff is helpful and consistent and they have me on a pricing structure that usually beats the box parts stores.
Pretty much any subsidiary of the Holley Group is trash now. Edelbrock was purchased by a private investment group who also own the largest aluminum foundry kettle thing. Their quality has slipped significantly from when an Edelbrock family member was at the helm. Generally the stuff with a Scott Drake reproductions tag is bottom tier. There is a Chinesium parts supplier that changes its name every few years to outrun the review inertia: ProComp/Speedmaster/Etc. MSD ignition is pretty poor now. Pretty much all electronics from China, including alternators and voltage regulators, circuit breakers, switches, and buttons.
Production has narrowed significantly so that a handful of factories produce repop or replacement parts, and they just put them in different boxes. You can still find some old stock stuff if you buy old stuff off eBay, but you have to watch the hustlers who put new junk in NOS boxes. They'll do that with OEM parts too on eBay and at swap meets because most people don't know a $10 part from a $250 OEM new old stock piece.
It will not be uncommon for you to return/replace 1 or 2 for being out of spec, even with Summit. But Summit is great about returns. Beware any house brand Summit stuff. It's always been okay to middling, but it's getting worse just because suppliers are worse.
Usually you can sort on Summit for Made in USA stuff, which is how I find most of the bits I need via mail order. I also lay in a stock of replacement parts for routine maintenance like valve cover gaskets, water pumps, oil pumps, brake components, etc.
Buy as much used OE stuff as you can and beware buying a classic that's been restored with "all new parts" because they took really good stuff and replaced it with shiny garbage that's 1/3 the quality.
That's disappointing to hear about Scott Drake stuff... I had been looking over the website and they had so much stuff. Scratch that, I guess..
really disheartening to see how badly the quality has fallen
ive heard too many tales of speedmaster/procomp head falt out not working out of the box with valves getting stuck in the guides and seats not being concentric and whatnot
if youre willing to check each head over and have it remachined if necessary they arent a bad deal if youre okay with china heads
The good news is if you can afford to buy good performance parts you can still get them. AFR, Meier, Mustangs to Fear, Rose Hill, and others still make good stuff. Mustang Steve still does brake stuff. NPD tends to have pretty good repop quality parts. Branda too. West Coast Classic Cougar has some Dynacorn stuff they've brought to market they're happy with, which says a lot. Even American based Pertronix has their stuff made in China, but it's a notch better than the bottom tier Vatozone stuff. I run one of their ignition boxes that's been really good quality.
I bought Rose Hill adjustable strut rods for my car like 2 years ago and they were fantastic. And they're just a small shop in Texas building stuff one piece at a time.
It's the middle class being squeezed who still want to build hot rods or classics and can't really afford to who are being catered to with cheapo go fast parts. The guys with Cobras and Shelbys can still buy all the good stuff they want. So, this is really a gulf broadening between people who can afford it and people who really can't. anymore but haven't yet been able to admit it to themselves. And Speedmaster has cleverly found a place in that niche, especially when people got those stimmy checks.
But we're all being screwed over by the pedestrian bits that are being built to lowest standard and hobbling all the classics. Even the guys with GT40s or Panteras can't escape distributor caps and plug wires made of the finest Wuhan cheeses.
I breathe a sigh of relief every time I buy something from Napa and see that it was made in Mexico. How far we've slid when that seems like something to celebrate over the true shit that does its long march from China
I wonder how much of that is “supply chain issues?”
It’s really gotten bad in the last year or so, as you hear on all the automotive YouTube channels.
Most of what I mean with "supply chain issues" is that a lot of stuff is filtering down from Covid era and just after. A lot of manufacturers figured out they can sell just as much shit quality as meh quality and pay half the wages.
However, there has been a significant drop in quality of cast parts over the last 6-10 years. IDKWTF is going on with that, but I've had brake drums shatter when barely dropped as a new normal.
Should’ve nuked Beijing when we had the chance! 🙄🤬🤬
much easier to keep alive when every single part is available
also its cool as hell
A Dynacorn body and repro parts for everything else (including a lot that are licensed from Ford).
Interesting analysis. Could you explain about cyber security and why it means no more gas 718s in Europe? I’m down to one car and it wouldn’t know what to do with a modem if it had one, so I don’t understand WTF “cyber security” has to do with a modern sports car.
https://cybernews.com/tech/car-models-disappearing-cyber-safety/
wow; thanks
That’s the most simplified version I found. It’s very UN/eurocrat. Means people are getting screwed for their protection.
First they turn cars into electric pods and surveillance devices, then they regulate them to "protect" drivers. You can't make this shit up.
Yep.
i dont know how much you hate them but you dont hate them enough
“ A new cybersecurity regulation, UNECE R 155, comes from the United Nations and requires carmakers…”
This sentence makes my brain explode. Fuck the UN and fuck Porsche and anyone else for kowtowing to them. I took a giant UN regulation in my toilet this AM before I got in the shower.
If they just made cars instead of rolling iPhones none of this would be a problem.
My head hurts.
Just to be clear…the ruling itself is not killing off the vehicles. It’s the fact that the micro and possibly other ICs need to be replaced, which means new SW, integration, validation, etc., (at both the module and vehicle level) which can run to the millions of dollars, per module.This is part of what is driving SDV (software defined vehicles) EE architectures.
Yeah, not sure what it has to do with cyber security, since it just creates a bigger attack surface. Unless they'll make us subscribe to an janky version of "Norton For Cars" as well... (don't laugh)
As for wifi/remote capability, I have no love for Teslas, but I do like how my friend can "pre-A/C" his MY from wherever we are, so it's cool by the time we get it. Spoiled and bougie? Sure. But it's been like Saigon here lately.
My Jeep would do that with remote start from a reasonable distance away. I’d click it from my 2nd floor office, and by the time I’d thrown my laptop in my bag, stopped to pee, and walked out the front door the Jeep would be ice cold (or toasty warm), no intrusive electronics needed.
I won't lie, I pay for OnStar just to have this feature. I never have to step in a hot/cold car if I don't want to. Worth the $40/month, and I hate needless tech.
Until the OnStar Police show up at your house and ask to see your papers :)
Or rat you out to your insurance - https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/11/technology/carmakers-driver-tracking-insurance.html
They can do that without me paying them. I justify it to myself by saying that at least I am getting some joy out of it.
Or the actual police show up because your city has an ordinance against leaving ICE cars and trucks idling.
In Michigan it's illegal to leave an unattended car running on public roads, private roads, and parking lots. Until the law was changed 7 years ago, it was technically illegal to warm up or cool down your car on your own driveway. In 2017, some guy in Roseville got a $128 ticket for warming up his car on his driveway, and the resulting furor forced the politicians/bureaucrats to change the law.
Have to start making bullets out of paper then...
I pay for the phone-based remote start as well. As long as I stay away from the “rate your driving and save on ur insurance (yeah, right), I should be good!
For $7 a month, my wifes KIA can do that too. Spoiler alert, I do not pay the $7
Or one could...you know...NOT connect your car to the Internet.
In the history of bad ideas, this one is near the top. No one can resist the revenue possibilities though.
I can't stand how we're being forced into electric vehicles.
I have zero interest in ever driving one.
Loathe the stuck up elites that decided this would happen
It's not going to happen and we need to make sure those responsible for the train wreck will be mercilessly ridiculed
by ridiculed don't you mean exiled to Salusa Secundus.
The prison planet? Let's not look too carefully at what happens there!
having read up on it, I think it's a great place to explore with EVs
Let’s start with mocking and shaming. Elites hate that.
And Jailed
How ‘bout something a little more permanent?!
Lead therapy
I should have a burning desire to own a Porsche. As a child of the seventies and the days before cable & VHS, I saw McQueen in Le Mans on the big screen twice per year during elementary school via community “movie night” programs. But nearing retirement and the opening of the Retirement Account vaults I find the only vaguely attractive hyper car to be the 2nd gen NSX.
I’ll probably end up buying a nice new Miata.
So it is true. I saw the usual circle jerk groups on Facebook bellowing loudly that Porsche "gets it". Honestly, I can't wait for the whole EV thing to collapse. I'm tried of reading self indulgent "car people" bemoan dinosaur ICE vehicles and the stupid people that drive them. Shit, Fords CEO made a plea for people to buy EV's and small cars again.
If that’d happen, maybe I’d buy another Accord!
I had a 2014 Ford Taurus with the 2.0 Ecoboost. Honestly, I loved that car. Ford I thought was doing a good job, better than GM on that front but all the same they threw in the towel and said "we can't do it!"
It’s just that it’s frustrating that all these automakers are just selling themselves out by producing the lowest common denominator product possible, when even a decade ago, they prided themselves on being the best! Honda made a midsize family sedan that giddyupped and cornered better than anything else in the class, and now they’re satisfied with peddling something that barely runs away from a PRIUS, much less a Camry!
Of course BMW lost the plot fifteen years ago, and Mercedes, which built cars to a standard, now peddles glorified golf carts that are barely better than the Chinese junk!
What are we as car enthusiasts to do?!
What Farley is really asking is for people to be willing to pay more for small cars. Until they are do, then Ford won't bother.
It doesn't break their heart to sell you an F150 instead.
this, exactly
"don’t be the sucker who buys one."
In general or is this Porsche specific? Because if I'm honest there are many combinations that would be hard to resist if brought back.
I'm not saying don't buy a four eyed Fox Coyote. Just don't be the person who pays $25k extra for ICE BOXSTER :)
I'd still buy one, not with the 25k extra though. You left that part unsaid in what you originally wrote.
My crystal ball is extremely fallible, but we ARE talking about the company that used to charge an extra eight grand to NOT provide a convertible top and which charged $200k extra to NOT have a wing on a 911GT3-Minus, er, 911R.
Well you and I may not fall for it, but clearly a whole bunch of boomer fucks paid em good money for that gimmickry, so are we really right to bitch about it?
Yeah, and you and I are probably physically capable enough to kill any woman in America with our bare hands*. Would we be right to take advantage of people as a result?
* based on the fact that I probably am, and you wouldn't make things any worse :)
This is an intellectual and moral question I have grappled with more and more in recent years.
Seems that's the way 'progress' is made in society isn't it?
Any deferment to 'right/wrong' really seems superficial to me these days.
911s NEED rear wings.
I have always maintained that real GT3s have wings.
didnt they all by virtue of being a gt3
The decision is cynical, crass and craven. Aka "Very Porsche" (tm)
It could also be a reasonable hedge if there's an econ event that actually does freak out the 1% (though, I fine those harder to imagine these days) and there's an auto bailout that's kinda-sorta prorated on an OEM's green-ness. We saw versions of that in 2008, after all.
I remember reading the original C&D review of the 944 Turbo S and - baked into my mind as much as the actual review - was the paragraph on how close Porsche was bankruptcy in post-1987 recession. They moved something like 14k cars annually in the early 90's. Those are Alfa numbers!
There was one year where they sold 5,000 cars IIRC.
1992 or 1993 IIRC. Many of those cars have since been raped by Singer, RWB, or similar.
I think Singers just don’t look right with their mash-up designs, but you have to hand it to them for separating even more money from wealthy people than even Porsche does. And they did it just by following the logic of the Porsche option list, which is more destructive to a rich person’s brain than a parasite. Singer just amped up the option list to levels that probably made Porsche jealous, and it was catnip to the 1%.
i kinda like options lists--at least porsche'd done it. as the first honda car dealer in oklahoma i got no notice when i asked honda to offer more options/deletes.
Oh, I like option lists, too, as that was the way you ordered cars back in the day. Packaging options ruined car ordering.
It’s just the sheer ridiculousness of the Porsche options like leather covered air vents.
I still have a serious desire for a 944 Turbo S. And in the canonical color combo: silver over burgundy with cloth seat inserts.
If I got a beater, I'd spiff it up in a Turbo Cup livery and annoy the hell out of my neighbors.
Sir, I assume you mean silver ROSE.
For the second time today, I surrender.
You’ve got the burgandy in the wrong spot. I like my 944s in burgandy on the outside.
Inside peanut butter, outside jelly
They produced ~65K 964s; Singer has probably made less than 1K cars.
FEWER
Defender of the faith (or at least the language). A medal is deserved, but that would be too pretentiously French.
Sir, I am an Appalachian-American.
redneck with a hard r
At $400,000 apiece.
They are 7 figures now.
I HIGHLY recommend this podcast in which Hannah Elliott and a Bloomberg Bug Man talk to Tom Wagner about his investment in Singer. He gives a lot of info on the biz.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/audio/2024-07-05/bloomberg-hot-pursuit-tom-wagner-on-singer-revology-podcast?sref=LY39ogSc
I would just *love* to know what series of myopic board room meetings led to GM and Cadillac green-lighting the Celestiq. Were they just chomping at the bit to get back to their pre-Sloanian "Standard of the World" days, and only thought they could justify it with an EV? Did they think an EV flagship would actually solidify the idea that EVs are luxury items and sell more Lyriqs and Optiqs and Escalade IQs (at a loss)? Did they just really want to capture a slice of the market of people who put 1,000 miles on a car a year?
Someone please inform me, because I can't think of a single good business case for the Celestiq, and I'm pretty imaginative. I also can't think of who would buy one, other than whichever Hollywood A-lister they've paid-off to be a brand ambassador for it.
I imagine the Celestiq would actually be a whole lot more relevant and desirable if it had one of GM's spectacular V8 engines. Hell, they could throw in a supercharged LS block, not unlike the one in the current Escalade V, or even the short-lived Blackwing V8 that was only used in the CT6-V and CT6 4.2 Twin-Turbo Platinum. Sadly, GM seems content to erase all of its excellent engineering history making cars that people wanted and still want, in favor of cars that it has to convince people they want.
BMW is doing the same thing with its current styling: working its damndest to erase any semblance of its classically balanced design or even the basic brand hallmarks. The current 5 Series looks like it could have been designed by anybody; there's nothing "BMW" about it. And so is Porsche, which is trying to disavow the history of entry-level cars that were genuinely good, in spite of how deliberately kneecapped they were.
It seems like all of these companies are apologizing for the great achievements of their past, and committing to making the future a lot less fun. Witness Mercedes: "We're sorry we once put a stonking 6.2-liter V8 in a car the size of a matchbox. Here, have this high-strung turbocharged electrified 4-cylinder wearing the same AMG 63 badge, instead!"
Meanwhile, I'm sorely tempted to buy a 2024 ES 350 Ultra Luxury. It's roomy, extremely comfortable, has lovely materials you don't get in cars costing twice as much, and has a naturally-aspirated V6 without hybridization *or* stop/start. And it'll last forever, if reasonably cared for. I have the S 550 Coupe, but an ES 350 makes a better--and more cost-effective--daily. And won't need preserving, while allowing me to preserve the S 550 Coupe.
that es350 looks pretty sharp
hope it wont ever give you problems
CT9, powered by Blackwing, is the car they should have made. But Mary Barra felt compelled to make De Nysschen look like a complete idiot. Duh...
They only made 800 cars with the Blackwing V8.
GM must have a corporate policy to cancel things prematurely.
Only if they're decent.
The X-car rear brakes got 18 months and over 2 million units!
The money keeps rolling in on their shit cars so it only reinforces their GM logic.
Will you SHUT THE FUCK UP ABOUT THE ES350UL
It is taking everything I have as a human being not to place an order for one already.
Have you tried being poor? That's worked for me so far.
We could really turn this country around if people would just stop being poor.
Too many are like me and are simply allergic to making money!
Tom Magliozzi from Car Talk:
“Don’t be afraid of work. Make work afraid of you. I did such a fabulous job of making work afraid of me that it has avoided me my whole life so far”
Bart: "Work's for suckers!"
Homer: "Son, I'm proud of you! I was twice your age before I figured that out."
I'm too poor to have an ES350UL in addition to what I have.
But I have an 835 beacon, which means they'll let me TRY.
300C not cutting it as a daily? Or just too rare/nice/interesting to use as such?
Also v relatable. Have a 800 beacon and have to get talked out of buying dumb shit alllll the time.
I only have 5100 miles on the 300C, albeit most of them at 6100rpm!
It feels like too much of a theft/drama magnet to use on a daily basis. I don't take it anywhere I'm not certain of the surroundings.
https://www.carscoops.com/2024/05/1982-chevrolet-corvette-with-33-miles-gets-first-wash-in-42-years/
In five years I could see myself driving one of these cars for old broken men.
That's what I am NOW!
My beacon's not far off that, but we don't buy what we can't afford.
You forgot "because"
That’s un-American crazy talk! You could get deported.
Oh shit. Please don't tell on me.
That is not a good-looking car. What ever happened to windows one could see out of?
I recently acquired a 2005 LS430 from a friend that makes financially ruinous decisions. It was on short money.
The plan was to send it on at 2x what I paid him, but we like the car more than expected. At 175k miles, I think it'll outlast any 2024 model car from any maker or price.
Man, do I not need reminding of my gem of an '06 LS430. Seems like forever ago, but it's only been a year, but that's life. It was not the decision (to sell) that I wanted to make, but it wasn't a bad decision. They are phenomenal cars. The engineers were actually given a decent budget to work with and they put those funds to good use.
The EV flagship thing is not a completely horrible idea, particularly for sales out here on the left coast. BUT, the idea that it should be almost as butt ugly as an Aztec is beyond unbelievable. How can they make such beautiful concept cars and such ugly bland productions cars? (yes, I knw, f***ing MBA types). WTF could they have not dropped the Ciel body onto the Ultium platform???
I happen to like the Celestiq's styling, but it's controversial, for sure. If it were effortlessly gorgeous or even as handsome as, say, a Rolls-Royce Spectre, a lot of people could forgive the fact that it's an EV.
The curse of the skateboard. Given the height of the Ultium pack, it would've been a transformation not unlike FT-1 to Supra.
I fully endorse the purchase of an ES350 from any gen. Drove an 09 for the better part of a year and it was wonderful. Had a 2024 as a loaner while my NX was in the shop and it was excellent. Apparently you have to be able to fold a paper crane using only your non dominant hand to work the line for the ES. Sounds like some straight Miyagi shit and I'm all for it.
I believe the folding of the paper crane with the non-dominant hand is a Lexus Takumi thing, not exclusive to the ES.
I read it in an article about 6 years ago so you very well could be right. Still wild.
Because one of those GM suits watched "RoboCop" the night before and wanted his own 6000SUX.
Do you think it went something like this:
1. Joe Biden said we have to do nothing but electrics from now on. He has barrels full of Chinese cash to sweeten the pot. Since Americans are ignorant sheep, they'll realize they have no choice and will beat down our doors to buy (lease) the latest and greatest.
- Isn't he a corrupt, senile old man?
- - That's ageist and smacks of colonialism. You're fired.
- Electric cars suck and we don't have the infrastructure to support it
- - You hate Mother Earth and your reflexive defense smacks of deep seated hatred. You too are fired!
2. Heritage doesn't sell cars. Everyone who matters want electric cars. CNN confirms this.
- I think our most loyal customers love their LS powered Silverados, Tahoes and Vettes. I don't think they'll make the transition. Don't we trot out commercials every Christmas season featuring some of our classic Chevy models with elderly white veterans pining for the America they lost and trying to remember it with a small block?
- - Listen you backwoods hillbilly piece of shit. I'm Mary, f-u-c-k-i-n-g Barra. I fought in the cutthroat trenches of HR and I know the likes of you wouldn't last five seconds in a fight with a woman like my good friend Rachel Levine. What makes you think a real woman like me is going to stand for your bullshit. Oh Hector, Ravindra and Mohammed - come in here and haul this honky piece of shit to the grave along with Harley Earl, Alfred Sloan and Bill Mitchell. Girl Power!
3. Come on carbon based forms of life with lived experiences. Let's get with the program and come up with some bold, dynamic ideas!
- How about we come out with an ultra exclusive electric Cadillac that will show the world that GM is all about corporate responsibility who is deeply invested in the new economy and effective stewardship of our collective resources. We'll price it so the knuckle draggers that can't see past their MAGA flags don't spoil the broth.
-- Do you hate Israel too? How do you look in a dress? You have VP written all over you
Here you overlook the value of using the word “bespoke” in the press kit, undermining your entire argument.
Touche...
thanks im mad now
"Let's get with the program and come up with some bold, dynamic ideas"
more like pogrom
Blame Barra!
I know I've stated that I like the Cadillac EV's styling direction, but have always had, silently, some reservation for the Celestiq's tail light design. Well, their "Bespoke" advertisement with that childish orange color and real-world driving [animation] [of the rear turn signals/brake lights particularly] confirmed the worst can-I-drink-her-pretty fears. Ugh.
This generation of ES is a sharp-looking one, and does a better job at looking proportionate, upscale, and of presence than the offroad-prerunner-front-wheel-fender-gap current-gen LS. A shame. And GS is long gone. I loved the GS line.
BMW "styling" is horrendous right now. I wish I could be that rich and that dumb (and blind) to buy one and be happy with it. Inversion is in with, well, literally everything now, so it's not surprising in that respect. Time to dream of E46 ZHP sedans again..
"Golf carts?" Even if you are (as I fully believe you are) completely unprepared ever to admit that an EV could be a fun car to drive, surely you can find less tired insults than that.
They are. I've driven plenty of Volvo EV's including Polestars that came in. Who doesn't smile with the low end torque. The issue is the culture. They were billed as earth saving, no maintenance, no nothing next wave of the future. They're anything but that.
As soon as an EV has a dynamic envelope equivalent to its ICE counterpart, I'll shut my mouth. For real. Radical has been doing EV prototypes. When they do SR8 laptimes with the same corner speeds, that will settle it for me. But I think you'll need some magic batteries.
That being said, how is the EV experience NOT golf-carty?
(As opposed to Sharon Silke Carty.)
You switch it on and nothing happens. You press the pedal and it whirs. There's no discernible character in the acceleration other than "less of it as you leave zero rpm".
If you're looking for no sacrifice in ultimate capability (in areas other than acceleration) then ICE cars will continue to win for the moment just based on lower weight. But, especially for those of us who don't spend time on tracks, "wider dynamic envelope" and "more fun" don't always go together at all.
And I think by "character in the acceleration" you mean "character in the noise." Or maybe "holes in the acceleration curve from peaky powerbands." Personally, the thing I get from EVs that I miss in the ICE cars is instant powertrain response. The fact that the acceleration is very linear is also a feature, not a bug. For me, the entertainment advantages of ICEs are limited at this point to the noise and, where present, the manual transmission.
Instant response is what motorcycles and low mass flywheels are for.
Anyway, the general sense for EVs is that they are lifeless and dull. They don't have the character, or flaws, that make a machine feel alive to a human. For some, that is worth the tradeoff. For others - those who want a commuter appliance - it isn't.
EVs aren't the panacea they're constantly sold as. They're not that great environmentally, they still require maintenance, their weight means chewing through tires, & etc.
Jack is sometimes hyperbolic and I assume it is purposeful.
"holes in the acceleration curve from peaky powerbands"
we have high pressure turbos and 10 speed transmissions
weve never had a flatter or broader powerband in history
It might be the noise but there is definitely something blocking my ability to have fun driving an EV.
I drove a nonGT version of an EV6 AWD for a few days. It was quiet, smooth, comfortable, and efficient (especially in city driving) but I never really *enjoyed* driving it even though its acceleration was somewhere between my Stinger and Charger.
Maybe a convertible EV would do something for me? I don't expect I'll like the fakery of things like the Ioniq5 N. Most likely scenario for me in an EV market takeover is I have a plug-in commuter car and then some hossed -up ICE pleasure car(s).
The noise is a big part of it, but it's so much more: the lack of revs, shifting, or anything at all for the driver to do, really. They're also boring to think/talk about because they're all mechanically identical, regardless of brand or country of origin. AND you can't work on them yourself or modify them unless you pay the manufacturer for some lame over the air software update.
Basically driving good ICE is like sex and the best an EV can offer is a silent poronographic movie. They might get you to the same place (maybe sometimes even faster), but all of the intimacy, engagement, and joy are notably absent.
the best thing about a good NA ICE is the sound (not noise) as the revs build to a crescendo, especially if paired with a manual transmission (which requires skill to rev match). No EV will ever match that.
You will hear people describe Lace Alumitones, which have a broader and flatter frequency response than conventional guitar pickups, as sounding "sterile" or "hifi", but is that just because people are used to hearing the midrange bump of conventional pickups?
If we all grew up driving glorified golf carts, we might think of that as the normal "character" of motor vehicles.
I think the color in chemical photography is more "real" than digital, but I'm willing to accept that's because that's what my brain was trained on.
I still think it's a stupid use of resources to use vehicles that weigh 25-50% more than a similar ICE vehicle, besides the fact that we don't have the grid for EVs. That being said, in some cases, like last mile delivery or taxis, EVs might make sense.
EVs are great as commuters, especially in stop and go traffic. No engine vibrations means a "chiller" experience. I really enjoyed my C-max just for that reason alone.
Just get yourself a McMurtry Spéirling!
Perhaps the ultimate “jumped up pantry boy” English kit car made in a shed.
It's only faster on the first lap!
blurring the line between electric car and rc car large enough to a human to sit in
We need fan car development. Forbidden technology lost to time
Also need more four rotor cars a la 787B
So this really happened two days ago.
I'm getting into my car (shitty, overpriced 2022 turbo-4 Boxster S that I drove 850 miles to Maine) after getting some nice Atlantic salmon. A young man, maybe 25, stops me and says "I've always wanted a Porsche, that's my favorite brand, and one day I'll get one!"
His girlfriend laughs and says " not at the rate you're going" just as I tell him "I'm sure you will."
A couple points to your article:
I'm pretty sure Porsche doesn't hate me. I've bought two new mid engined cars from them in the past eight years. Price wise there isn't a $30-$50,000 gap between my high spec 991 and 718 and the non-S 911. It's much more of a price continuation. High spec 718s run into the $140,000 range.
The average 40 year old first time Porsche sports car buyer doesn't know anything about pre VW Porsche. The 50-70 year old Porsche buyer doesn't care about that old stuff, the cars today are a world different from the 993 or 996 or early Boxsters.
Not everyone feels a need to buy the most expensive 911 they can afford, trust me. Many guys I know have both 911s and Boxsters or Caymans. They aren't interchangeable or exclusive of one another.
It is entirely possible to both know you are being cynically manipulated by a car brand AND enjoy its products, especially since you also know your resale value is likely to be very high.
"It is entirely possible to both know you are being cynically manipulated by a car brand AND enjoy its products'
I mean, this is literally the Apple playbook lol.
Speaking of which, I'm currently sitting in my empty Alfa/Maser dealer for service and I can't help but think the brands would better served by setting up shop Apple Store-style in high-end malls.
Lotus has their Paris showroom in a high end district next to luxury boutiques. Very practical experience and significantly easier to get close to the car without having to go into some district far outside the city. Especially for brands with few models this approach would make sense. On a side note, I genuinely don’t understand the obsession of American dealers to have 100s of new cars on the lot, instead of just allowing customers to order specific configurations.
The Manhattan and Bev Hills "flagship" dealers are more like that. I think MB of Manhattan might even be operated by MB of NA. I think Jack had a piece a long time ago about how the dealers were the customers not the public, so even though we hate the dealer world, the OEMs actually like having a retail-level dog to kick when they need to (vs owning the retail-level headaches).
I think a hybrid approach could work for a niche maker like Alfa/Maser. A handful of OEM-run flagship stores in major cities and upscale malls, and leave the existing dealers (which are dying off anyway) in place. Like how, for an iphone, you can go to the Apple Store, but also go to a franchised Verizon store... or some 3rd party electronics shop as well.
We lost our Alfa and Maserati dealers here in OKC. The Alfa Romeo and Fiat dealer became the used Hyundai building, then Genesis, and now Genesis has launched its own standalone store across the street, and the building is likely to be torn down for extra lot space on the Hyundai side.
Our Maserati dealer was also Jaguar and Land Rover (actually, prior to this, it was Land Rover, Saturn, Saab and Hummer)…but they just tore down the building and made a new one, and very deliberately left Maserati out. I think there’s one master tech who works on the Maseratis.
At some point, I'd love to read something on why the Germans succeeded in America and the other Euros didn't.
My hunch is that is has to do with industrial policy. That is, the Germans had fewer labor issues, therefore didn't have the infamous quality issues of French and Italian cars, which in turn made relations with US dealers less strained. And the dealer experience is massively important to success in the US.
The Japanese, I assume, succeeded purely through the right-product-right-time (and also having few labor surprises) in the 1970s. And the Koreans by being cheap and reliable (enough) to stomach the dealers.
EDIT: my "like" here is purely appreciation for the local info; if there was a "like, but I hate the news", I'd click it.
"It is entirely possible to both know you are being cynically manipulated by a car brand AND enjoy its products, especially since you also know your resale value is likely to be very high."
Why, I would never...
(examines IWCs in watch case)
...fall prey to that!
My first IWC arrives on Thursday...
MAZEL TOV
That might be more appropriate for the Jacob & Co. Astronomia Solar Zodiac.
Mazel Tov literally means "A good constellation", the Mazalot being the signs of the Zodiac.
does that make subaru slightly jewish
Malcolm Bricklin got into the car business trying to import Subarus to Israel after first hooking up with them importing Subaru Rabbit scooters to the U.S.
"His girlfriend laughs and says " not at the rate you're going" just as I tell him "I'm sure you will.""
Props to you for encouraging a young man.
I would have added, to the girlfriend, "Embarrassing your man in front of other people says more about you than him."
Sometimes I can't decide if I'm the bees knees or cream of the crop but thank you.
the bees cream
Cream of Bees sounds like a nice Campbell’s dish, served hot on a cold night.
itd be a great name for whipped honey
It’s something Python would say, like maybe part of the Crunchy Frog skit.
“And this one stung me!”
“Ah, yes, that has the cream of bees filling”
“Oh, you’ll get that Porsche. Might wanna trade her in when you do…”
Name an automaker that hasn’t “lost their way”. I’ll wait…
The two that come the closest, in my opinion:
Toyota (still has a manual available in a truck and has the GR— with Toyoda saying EV’s are not necessarily the answer) and Mazda (Miata and some fun to drive stuff up and down the line up).
All car companies have abandoned their core personalities searching for market share. As the differences wane, so does brand enthusiasm.
Not so sure about Toyota. They absolutely botched the new Tundra and the Crown is dubious at best.
Hey now, this is avoidable contact, so we MUST piss on Porsche every chance we can get. Clearly they're the WORST, and Frod (because they once employed the Baruth brothers in one capacity or another) can do no wrong, and GM is a bunch of losers except for the plastic corvettes, which are the best, blah blah...
Anything to stray from the goddamn formula of what to like and what to dislike would run afoul of people having a brain and wanting to decide for themselves.
"Anything to stray from the goddamn formula of what to like and what to dislike would run afoul of people having a brain and wanting to decide for themselves."
To the contrary, that's what I'm here to encourage. And unlike the competition, I don't try to mask my opinions behind a veneer of "everyone thinks" or "experts say".
Just for clarity, I worked for Ford Credit, and I worked for a Ford dealership. I have never been a direct employee of any automaker. I also worked for BMW Credit, and for Honda, both as a contractor, in addition to selling Infinitis during 1994.
I will ABSOLUTELY piss on Porsche every chance I get. Even if it's TOO strident. Someone has to balance the bought-and-paid-for Porsche PR masquerading as autowriting elsewhere.
This would be fair to us if we were consuming the drivel from elsewhere. I don't even read much else auto related these days which is why this seems unnecessary to me.
It's like the feminists who like to remind you every 30 minutes not to rape.
This is fair and I'll keep it in mind. This publication should, as a rule, gratify the people who use it the most, not always be a counter to what else is out there.
Hahaha!!
A lot of women apparently feel safer with a bear in the woods than with a man they don't know. If you ask them what percentage of men would attack them, they'll say stuff like 50%. They have been indoctrinated to believe that most men are monsters.
That perplexes the 99% of men who don't think that rapists and pimps are role models.
I suppose the corresponding question for men would be, which is more likely to falsely accuse you of misconduct or entrap you with paternity fraud, a bear, or a woman?
I'd still rather come across a brunette than a bruin.
The joke, is of course, that statistically bears have different rates of likelihood of attack based on type, which of course, is identified by color.
So if one asked “would you want to be with a bear in the woods?” an intelligent reply would be “what color bear?”
I’ll let you fill in the rest of the joke yourself.
Anyone ask the spit girl that question?
You may be conflating the percentage of "men in general" with "men that women choose."
When Nichole (age 18) began dating OJ Simpson, he was still married to Marguerite who was pregnant with his daughter, and, on the very first date, she returned with ripped jeans due to OJ's attempt to get inside them. So, NATURALLY, she decided to keep seeing him again and ultimately marry. Whereupon he was chronically verbally, emotionally, and physically abusive and chronically unfaithful.
It would be interesting to interview some of the men who saw her working at The Daisy and were unceremoniously rejected.
My wife feels safest with a man-bear.
The extremely online crowd is mostly retarded
Gotta have something they want first.
https://www.amazon.com/Touch-Liquor-Shall-Prohibition-Poster/dp/B09BKJKG3L?th=1
Boom ,don't mind it, think of it as an automotive form of Tourettes.
I give Jack props on doing this just days before the subscriptions renew for many in the first wave. Six days to go for me says Substack.
Remember I said “the closest” and that “All car companies have abandoned their core personalities”.
Definite hedging. On purpose.
The current Mazda 3 is much softer than its predecessor (but at least you can still get a manual).
TIL the Mazda6 is dead and I shall wear sackcloth and ashes
Had to look up what the f’ TIL is. Can we please just use English? (Cranky today- more than usual. Always old and out of touch.) Sorry, I shouldn’t hammer a fellow motorcycle racing aficionado. I’m ashamed.
Anyway, the 6 has been dead to me for years— since they stopped offering the manual. Maybe 2018?
They did.
But the Crown is relatively low-volume, and couldn’t possibly sell worse than the Avalon did. If anything, it’s a compelling product, especially for older people who don’t necessarily want to crawl into a traditional sedan anymore. I’m reminded of the Ford D3 cars (Five-Hundred, Montego, Taurus, Sable, MKS, Flex), which had quite tall H-points for what they were and sat a good half a foot taller than other sedans.
And the Tundra is a Toyota truck. The Tundra stopped being competitive a long time ago (I’d say around 2014 at the latest) and yet people continued to make excuses for it. They’ll make excuses for the new one, too…even if it tends to grenade engines. All Toyota really needed to do was not upset its fanbase, and it mostly hasn’t. Toyota doesn’t really need to chase sales from the (far-superior, IMO) Detroit half-tons.
But the core Toyota products: the RAV4, the Grand Highlander, the Corolla, the Prius, the Camry, the Sienna…those, they seem to be getting quite right, at least in all the ways that matter.
What pisses me off about Toyota—and I think it has definitely forsaken its customer base here—is that it the pandemic taught the company to deliberately constrain inventory on its hybrids, in order to keep transaction prices high and incentives low. And it’s one thing when Porsche does it, but Toyotas are supposed to be reasonably accessible to the general public. Someone shouldn’t have to be on a waiting list for two years to get a mid-level Sienna XLE. And I checked recently on national Prius inventory, to find that there were only 600-odd listed online, and a good portion of those were incoming units that hadn’t yet been built or delivered to their final stores.
Thanks for the thoughtful analysis.
I've yet to actually see a Crown in the wild here in central Kansas. I presume they've moved a few in larger metros. Do you see them on OKC? The higher H-point is well taken. My 83 year old mother prefers getting in and out of our Ford Maverick way more than the Porsches, Fiats, Alfa Romeos or BMWs around here.
As for the Tundra, I agree that the "people who don't actually need a truck" crowd are probably well served with the new model (if it doesn't grenade). The people who do need a truck are not buying them. The previous generation was not competitive feature wise but was basically un-killable despite the minimal maintenance and ranchers beating the living daylights out of the things. The new ones just aren't up to the task at hand and many dealers won't take them on trade so they're stuck. The whole thing seems very un-Toyota like.
Hopefully the GDI turbo hybrid setup in the Tacoma, 4 Runner and Land Cruiser is better sorted.
On availability...can you blame them? The entire industry relished in availability constrained profits of the pandemic. They all vowed not to return the the overproduction of pre-pandemic. Ford was only going to allow a handful of stock configurations, and everything else was to be an order. Now we're post-pandemic and only Honda and Toyota are able to learn anything. Between UAW contracts and a complete lack of discipline the market is flooded again.
Even the best companies make mistakes. But unlike other companies, Toyota has a habit of going to extraordinary lengths to do right by their customers. (e.g. rusted frame Tundra buyback).
Heck, Lexus once had a problem with dashboards in the early noughties and they offered to replace the dash on every defective car on three different models for three model years. I've never heard of a company that went that far.
I wonder what Colin Chapman would say about Lotus today. Though when he ran Lotus himself, he was not adverse to making bigger, heavier, more luxurious cars as the company grew. There was a four door executive sedan on the drawing board (the Chapman family car was a 450S Merc) when he died.
Well, as a traditionalist old guy that has a hard time finding anything current mildly interesting; I want to believe he would hate the direction it’s heading. I certainly do. Especially the Chinese ownership.
And yes, I did want “current” read in the above sentence as “recent vintage” and a reference to EVs.
He would say “where’s my check?”
Absolutely!
His best friend said that he wasn't a man to be trusted with your wallet or your wife.
you reckon he liked his women as spindly and lightweight as his racecars
His wife Hazel was slim.
he is probably rotating in his coffin at mach jesus and the second we figure out how to harness that power is the same second evs become viable
When Mazda stops making an all-ICE Miata you know it's over.
Very much the same has happened with my beloved Aston Martin (1913-2000 RIP). The current Aston Martin literally has nothing to do with the company I fell in love with as a child. They were lousy cars, but great experiences. You are hard pressed to find a classic Aston with more than 25,000 miles on it, because issues were not uncommon. But, in quality of craftsmanship, they were unlike anything else on the road.
Then failed Porsche, BMW and Daewoo (!) exec Ulrich Bez took over and decided to turn Aston into a higher priced, lower quality Porsche copy. He pissed all over the Aston heritage, naming conventions, etc, and got rid of the craftsmanship that made Aston unique. Of course, Aston has crashed from financial disaster to disaster since he “recreated” it. And in a show of ego that must even impress the ranks of exotic car executives, he had the temerity to name his autobiography of his Aston years “Making Aston Martin”. You arrogant prick. Aston was made by the giants on whose shoulders you stood. And if that wasn’t enough, he charged the better part of $500 for it. It’s sad to watch the great marques fall one by one.
We will eventually see the day when one V600, or POW drophead, is worth as much as every Bez Aston put together.
Aston has “crashed to disaster” with greater frequency than Spain has had civil wars. And that takes some doing.
I don’t think there’s any market for the sorts of flawed hand built cars the British were known for making. Jaguar, Aston Martin, Land Rover, Bentley and Rolls-Royce would probably no longer be here if they hadn’t been absorbed by larger firms.
At least Aston Martin isn’t MG, which is basically a Chinese car brand with a storied name.
And while I won't buy one, it seems to me that an EV sports car makes a hell of a lot more sense than an EV anything else. How do people drive sports cars? A time or two a week, Sunday morning, Cars and Coffee, 20-50 mile twisty run. No range anxiety, fast acceleration, convertible, why shouldn't that be enough?
I used to think Porsche wouldn't sell more than a handful of them, now I'm not so sure.
Agreed, except... they gotta turn. Probably the heaviest car that turns is the fifth-gen Z28. Every EV out there weighs more.
True, unless the driver in question has never driven anything that turns well. In that case it just needs to turn better than the rest of the two ton EVs to seem amazing.
This explains why Tesla owners often rave about their car's handling... because they are coming directly from their parents' hand-me-down minivans, or public transportation!
Me and my 2013 T&C "S" with the "sport" suspension take offense!
Even a shopping cart handles well when you're only pushing down the supermarket aisle.
This is the point you always miss. They DONT have to turn. They only have to LOOK like they can turn. Only the 1 percent that ever drives a Vette or a Porsche or what have you ever go fast enough to make real turning matter. For the rest, all Porsche has to do is put idiots like Farah or Lieberman in an EV sports car for 20 minutes to shoot their video and it's all good.
I think that even a normie can tell the difference between a Boxster 3.2 and a Boxster EV in slightly vigorous daily use. Especially if they have years in the former.
Bruh, does a Cayman turn? Not turn-in, but turn?
A few years ago, Sam Smith and I ran a GT4 Cayman against a Shelby GT500 around NCM West, which is very much a short track. Laptimes were identical, although accomplished in different ways. The nice thing about a Cayman is that it out-turns a 911 or a ponycar. Against a Corvette... well, we all have our limitations.
I haven't driven a gt4 but found too much understeer under sustained cornering. You missed what I was hinting at.
For a mid engined car that level of under steer is unacceptable to me.
Of course this is all relative.
Almost nothing has enough front tire now. That's true of McLarens, Porsches, you name it. But it's easily fixed.
I ran 225-width tires on my 993 for its entire life. The factory width was 205, to make sure you NEVER got it sideways.
For my Boxster, I went from 225/265 to 245/285, which was about right.
Every time I switch between winter and summer tires I'm reminded of how different tires can affect the overall character of a car. Summer tires are 205/50 vs 185/55 OEMs. Speedo is within 1% of stock.
On the Mustang forums whenever anyone is talking about going to or increasing an already staggered set up my eyes just start rolling involuntarily. Of course some of those guys have legit drag cars, in which case you may as well go barely street legal depending on your class, and if it's just for show then go nuts, but some of them actually think the car oversteers from the factory.
In the spirit of sta ying between the lines we should talk about cars as delivered from the factory.
I could personally fix a lot of stuff to make a car drive like it should, but do hold the maker accountable for not doing the work or pinching pennies.
They do understeer, no doubt. You can't get the tail out like in a 911 without fairly throwing it into a corner which isn't all that effective.
The GT4s have different front geometry that's supposedly better.
i thought they pulled that from their cup cars
not a fan of when oems put skinny tires at the front even on mid engined cars especially when theres so much room and it can keep you from overheating them
If you aren’t road tripping your sports car you’re doing it wrong.
I’m still trying to decide if I should take my bucket list Route 66 road trip in my S2000, or if I should buy a Corvette (which one???) and do it the right way.
You're not wrong, I drove the Boxster 850 miles from Michigan to Maine this spring.
Yesterday I not only saw an S2000 in a supermarket parking lot but an Acura NSX, the original one, on the the same day. What are those odds? Maine is a funny place for cars.
Seconded. Just did 2,500kms around France in mine last month…and not ALL of it was in the rain!
C5 or C6 coupe (GS if the latter). A lot of room and the top comes off (you just need to find a place to put it). Pack light and you'll be ok.
C6 is a better car but C5 Z06s are slutty cheap…
YMMV, but I think C5Zs are overpriced post-COVID. A decent one with lower (but not super low) is 30 grand.
The convertible has plenty of room in the trunk, although I imagine the vibe is different.
Didn't know that. I've never taken a close look at a convertible. If that's the case, then go with the convertible and don't worry about where to store the targa top.
The 2013 427 Convertible is an interesting car.
Why not BOTH! S2000 now, Corvette when you can.
I did 4700 miles from Minneapolis to Laguna Seca in May for the IMSA weekend, then south through the national parks and home. My buddy was in his Miata and I was the "support vehicle" in my Toyota 86.
great trip!
because that experience is much better with a characterful ICE and a good manual transmission. And a light weight car.
CeleryStiQ is very good stuff.
I've had ancestral DNA testing three times (because the results were so unexpected).
I think I might be more Nigerian than the woman in the Cadillac ad.
john
we wuz the target demographic an sheit