between the two options i much prefer not having the rivets and while that might seem like a minor quibble i have the scratch marks on doors and fenders to show that its something at least i need to be careful of
I am wearing some All American Clothing canvas trousers in Grey right now. Of note: the sizing is forgiving in the waist, and more importantly the rise is larger than typical and I am suspending the pants instead of using a belt because the belt would ride them too low for me!
Theyre very stiff on arrival, construction seems decent after a month of use, all in all a bit mixed on them due to the rise.
Challenger Hellcat and Chicago, what? I am shocked, shocked it took from 2016 to 2024 for it to get stolen. What were you keeping it under lock, key, and 44 Mag for all that time. 😮😮
That would have been prudent, I didn't even have a Club. Apparently a bunch of cars are stolen at the same time by groups at O'Hare; the lead car drives through the gate and the rest follow and then disperse. Police won't do anything because they won't risk lives for property.
Not surprised as with the “blame the cops” attitude of Lorie Lightweight and the current goofball in the Mayors Office. I guess it’s surprising that the men and women of the CPD even show up for their shifts. But makes driving anything nice a real problem.
CPD is not impressive. There’s nothing they love more than NOT working while on their shift and instead smoking cigars in a private club, or claiming they have “explosive diarrhea” every time there’s police work to do … and complain about “only” making $250K while they do next to zero work.
Last month some middle of the night miscreants broke into the Mazda dealership where I bought my Miata and stole a Hellcat from the service bay. Also nabbed an Infinity just for shits and giggles.
To be fair, had I known exactly where you were going to put it, I would have recommended you get a Challenger Hellcat and a full-time security guard for it, preferably one with a LICENSE TO KILL.
I’ve kept American Giant polos and tees in rotation for the last decade and they’re great. Everything I’ve ever bought from them has held up well, fit well, and not lost shape over time. Well worth the extra cost.
The American Giant t shirts, in Medium for my 40" chest, are cut just tight enough to touch my armpits, which has left excellent deodorant stains after two years of use. My tri blend American Apparel custom ink startup shirts never had armpit stains after a decade of service, in one case. This is a disappointing turn of events, because it means my Gustin polos (in large) will inevitably suffer the same fate.
Meh. My first AG hoodie's drawstring grommets popped off within a month or two. They sent me a new one FOC and didn't ask for the jacked up one back, which was fair I guess. The cuffs are pretty worn out on the first one, the 2nd is not far behind because it doesn't get worn as much. I'm down to one AG long sleeve t-shirt because of the same disintegrating cuff issue and generally wearing out. I'm not hard on my clothes, but these were going on a decade of use. I just bought a trio of Chinese (bleh) long sleeves from True Classic just to replace my other soon to be crapped out winter shirts.
I've had some pretty good luck lately at my Goodwill & indie thrift store so I'm gonna roll with them for a while. I scored a Tektronix 2215 scope for $39 too!
Back in the 80’s my older brother worked for Sundstrand. They sold off a bunch of their old test equipment and I was able to buy a giant Tektronix o-scope with my lawn mowing money. Smelled like years of cigarettes when you turned it on.
I like the MOAB a lot, thank you for the comparison and heads up! I have a nice collection of Dearborn Denim now after you brought them to my attention a few years back, but recently needed a pair of khakis in a specific shade for a trade show uniform (yeah, I know... the things we do to feed our children), and did you know Amazon Basics has clothing now? 25 fiat bucks and 8 hours of delivery later and they are... fine? After the show they are now my go to change the oil/clear brush pants, it's what they deserve and I don't care what happens to them. I'll grab the MOAB to wear as 'nice' pants.
I smoked a cigar this evening with a new friend who works for McKinsey (just finished his MBA at Booth); he is in town working on / facilitating a substantial M&A deal in the payments space.
He told me he felt a bit apprehensive in his previous assignment / engagement: Helping a midwestern factory lay off some dead weight. He told me that he was probably one of the only people in history to have worn steel-toed boots (they dress as the client does, to fit in) while also wearing a Lange 1 - https://www.alange-soehne.com/us-en/timepieces/lange-1/lange-1
Sherman, so sorry you friend felt apprehensive wearing $44,000 watch while he worked to end someone’s livelihood. You should maybe tell your friend he should maybe stop by the mall and pick up a Timex for such occasions.
Bear in mind: The owner of the factory hired McKinsey to harvest cost savings; he works for McKinsey; that was his job. McKinsey got paid a portion of the efficiencies they identified.
Just saw my new buddy a moment ago. He had hoped that his next assignment - to begin next month - would be in London, but now it’s looking like he’ll be stuck in Peoria, IL. He whined that he’s trading a glorious summer of long lunches at Scott’s in Mayfair with ready access to the world’s best cigar lounges for Golden Corral. I helpfully reminded him that his steel-toed boots will get some more mileage!
This is what Dana Thomas wrote in her newsletter last week:
“In my book Fashionopolis: The Price of Fast Fashion and the Future of Clothes, I highlight one case to tell the story: Levi’s.
During the 1990s, Levi’s closed all of its US plants, including one in Blue Ridge, Georgia, an Appalachian Mountain town of fourteen hundred, that had been in operation for forty-three years. Levi’s had already laid off 300 at Blue Ridge a year earlier. Now it was giving pink slips to the final 400.
From Fashionopolis:
These were blue-collar jobs. Most workers earned $8 to $14 an hour for such tasks as making belt loops, attaching rivets, and sewing zippers into jeans. Some took home as little as $20,000 a year. But Levi’s made up for the low pay by being a generous member of the community— donating to the hospital, schools, nursing homes, the public library, and Little League teams.
In 2001, it gave $10,000 to the fire department for a new communications system, and each Christmas, it sent small bags of grooming products or a bit of cash to senior citizens at the local health center. Over the years, the company contributed several thousand dollars toward the county’s first mobile defibrillator and helped pay for a Jaws of Life hydraulic rescue tool for car crashes, curling irons for a cosmetology course, and field lights at the stadium. “They’ve just allowed us to have a lot of things we couldn’t have had,” the high school principal, Doug Davenport, said.
That was over. Blue Ridge became an emblem for the economic and social destruction that profit-driven short-term decisions taken in boardrooms—like offshoring—caused in small manufacturing towns across America.”
I got the opposite impression from Jack. AG are more expensive and more stylish with the rivets making them slightly less practical if your work involves bumping against stuff.
I also had this experience but didn't bother with a return on a medium polo which is LIKE WEARING A MUMU whereas the M t-shirt is on the too snug size.
I bought my first pair of American Giant Roughneck pants back before Covid and I've still got them - along with four other pairs. They're suitable for everything short of a dressy occasion (though the black ones will do in a pinch) and the only pants I wear anymore. They're just that comfortable and durable. Can't recommend them more highly.
I've got a pair of CostCo / Kirkland jeans for any dirty work that needs doing.
i occasionally wear my dad's 1936 blue pinstripe self-belted cream flannel trousers. they look about a year old. way back when, mom didn't like me wearing his no-lapel pale green seersucker suit so she threw it away around '65
During One Lap Of America 2006, I wore a Brooks Brothers seersucker suit for the southern leg of the route. This was widely lampooned, and with good reason!
About a year ago, I got an email from brooks brothers about how now "We are a global brand" or "Citizens of the world" type shit. I haven't bought a thing from them since. Of course, now I need new dress shirts and I have no idea what to buy as that was typically my go to brand.
I was in a similar position. Todd Shelton and Gitman both looked to have a good selection of USA-made shirts. Can’t speak to the quality, I ended up switching jobs and no longer need to maintain a closet of “nice” shirts. It’s branded Ogio polos for me now.
"A very tiny bit, mind you, which is how we go from denim being genuinely offensive to a lot of people in 1965 to being a wink-and-nod from an establishment pop songwriter."
I was only 10 years old in 1965 but it seems to me that the only place blue jeans could have been considered offensive is if you wore them to weekly religious services, a wedding, or a funeral. In other words, dressing casual for a somewhat formal event. Boys wore blue jeans or other dungarees to school. I have to say, though, that I don't think I ever saw my father or any fathers of my friends ever wearing jeans. People still dressed up to fly and wore suits to baseball games back then.
For daily services I'll wear whatever I have on. For Sabbath services I'll put on a suit. I also wear suits to funerals, unless I'd otherwise miss them. Jewish funerals take place within 24 hours of death, if possible, so sometimes you find out about them at the last minute - I once went to the funeral and burial of a bike riding friend's father in my Lycra riding gear because I found out right after finishing a long ride.
during the 1960s, but the rules for dress while eating in the residence halls were as well. The old rule of men being required to wear coats and ties while eating in the dormitory dining halls had been in effect since the end of World War II. Based on a survey from students not finding the old way of dressing all that popular, a new rule was set in place. Male students were now required to wear clean and neat dress slacks (no jeans or shorts), dress shirts (no t-shirts, knit shirts, plaids, or bold stripes), and dress shoes (no slippers, tennis shoes, clogs, or thongs)
I'm pretty sure all that was gone by the time I started at Michigan in 1972. There were no dress codes. I had visited Michigan State before graduating high school because they were recruiting me and so my mom and my dad could visit East Lansing, where they lived while my father attended vet school. I don't recall the kids at State dressing any differently than the kids in Ann Arbor.
By the time I got to Michigan, men were allowed in the Michigan League and women were allowed above the first floor of the Michigan Union.
A lot of things had changed by the end of the '60s. Not all for the good. Not all for the bad.
It was regarding the late 1970s at MSU, and was mentioned because it was remarkable, and I may have even heard it first-hand. Perhaps the person was not being fully truthful.
And yes, 1964-1965 was a year of major change: the "Middle Atlantic accent" was no longer taught, and almost all English-speaking countries radically changed their immigration systems almost simultaneously.
Speaking of change, I recently learned of this and found it sad:
"The only place blue jeans could have been considered offensive is if you wore them to weekly religious services, a wedding, or a funeral. In other words, dressing casual for a somewhat formal event. Boys wore blue jeans or other dungarees to school. I have to say, though, that I don't think I ever saw my father or any fathers of my friends ever wearing jeans. People still dressed up to fly and wore suits to baseball games back then."
Ronnie, I think you're making my point to say that children wore denim and adults did not.
My mother was once expelled from a country club in Lower Alabama for a dress code violation (denim).
We were at some lake down there for a wooden boat show, and she had the temerity to attempt entry to the clubhouse at 7:45 AM to pick up continental breakfast for her children while wearing jeans.
I'm not disagreeing, but I think "considered inappropriate at times" was closer to the tenor of the time than offensive. Grok says that the jeans Brando wore in The Wild Ones "were a key part of his character's defiant, anti-establishment image". That was in 1953.
Elvis wore jeans in his early movies.
"Jailhouse Rock (1957): Elvis, as Vince Everett, wears blue jeans in scenes that emphasize his rebellious, working-class character, particularly during the iconic "Jailhouse Rock" dance sequence.
King Creole (1958): Playing Danny Fisher, Elvis dons jeans in parts of the film, fitting the gritty, New Orleans street vibe of his character.
G.I. Blues (1960): As Tulsa McLean, Elvis wears jeans in off-duty scenes, aligning with his character's laid-back, youthful persona."
glad to see the comparison
between the two options i much prefer not having the rivets and while that might seem like a minor quibble i have the scratch marks on doors and fenders to show that its something at least i need to be careful of
"30/32/24 length"
i think a 24 length qualifies it as a capri pant
I think the 24 is a typo as the other contender is 30/32/34. 🙂🙂
i think youre entirely correct lynn
The founders son is a rotund dwarf, he makes sure each style is available for him.
The 24 may be an onlyfans version
ngl i have no idea what that even means
to make the feet visible. The joke failed
why would the feet not already be visible while wearing pants
In reality they would be. It made sense as a joke, somehow, when I saw the orginal comment
maybe amish women posing for onlyankles but then they wouldnt be wearing pants anyway
Not that there’s anything wrong with that.
Picked up an Origin hoodie and pair O’ pants after your last shout-out to them. GOOD STUFF.
I am wearing some All American Clothing canvas trousers in Grey right now. Of note: the sizing is forgiving in the waist, and more importantly the rise is larger than typical and I am suspending the pants instead of using a belt because the belt would ride them too low for me!
Theyre very stiff on arrival, construction seems decent after a month of use, all in all a bit mixed on them due to the rise.
Yeah they just seem like ENORMOUS PANTS
I agree - they're big pants. I was shocked to read they don't do vanity sizing. that said, they're very comfortable once they soften up.
Big pants.
https://youtu.be/tUvoehvAm8Y?si=JOoJ_mlWTVKrJLLb
Sounds like that's my brand then! Hahaha
Since I always trust Jack's purchase recommendations, just bought a pair of each to check them out.
He's never steered me wrong. Got a 2016 Challenger Hellcat, among other things; it was fantastic.
Sadly, that was stolen from the parking garage at O'Hare last Fall.
Challenger Hellcat and Chicago, what? I am shocked, shocked it took from 2016 to 2024 for it to get stolen. What were you keeping it under lock, key, and 44 Mag for all that time. 😮😮
That would have been prudent, I didn't even have a Club. Apparently a bunch of cars are stolen at the same time by groups at O'Hare; the lead car drives through the gate and the rest follow and then disperse. Police won't do anything because they won't risk lives for property.
Not surprised as with the “blame the cops” attitude of Lorie Lightweight and the current goofball in the Mayors Office. I guess it’s surprising that the men and women of the CPD even show up for their shifts. But makes driving anything nice a real problem.
CPD is not impressive. There’s nothing they love more than NOT working while on their shift and instead smoking cigars in a private club, or claiming they have “explosive diarrhea” every time there’s police work to do … and complain about “only” making $250K while they do next to zero work.
are they hiring
You are probably way over qualified.
You need a supersize helping of moral flexibility.
The police in Chicago don’t do anything because they’re *ordered* not to do anything. The thugs are part of the Mayor’s voting base.
Sorry to hear about your car.
I doubt it's a direct order. More of a "Nice pension you got there, it'd be a shame if anything happened to it"
Don't arrest the token minorities for real crimes but make sure you get the guys who can afford to pay DUI fees.
I agree, but they also have to call in for an approval to chase suspects in cars, and are almost always turned down.
this is why i like the gorgia state patrol
i saw those guys pit manoeuvre a box truck once
So if I'm gonna drive drunk, do it in a stolen car!
We’re about 5 years and a few Arduino libraries away from homeowners equipping castoff Kuka robots with PCCs to serve as automated sentries.
A. Part of me loves that.
B. I forsee issues.
Last month some middle of the night miscreants broke into the Mazda dealership where I bought my Miata and stole a Hellcat from the service bay. Also nabbed an Infinity just for shits and giggles.
https://www.news5cleveland.com/news/local-news/shattered-glass-and-a-broken-garage-door-kent-police-investigate-incident-at-mazda-dealership
If Sherman finds this one too, I'm just going to start assuming he's the car thief
To be fair, had I known exactly where you were going to put it, I would have recommended you get a Challenger Hellcat and a full-time security guard for it, preferably one with a LICENSE TO KILL.
Sorry for your loss. That is why my Daytona Charger stays at home if I will be parking anywhere in the city.
I have some security measures but my Charger still doesn't get parked anywhere past dusk except my garage.
yet another reason i love my M2. its not aspirational enough for folks to buy just for the flex, and not showy enough for reprobates to target.
I’ve kept American Giant polos and tees in rotation for the last decade and they’re great. Everything I’ve ever bought from them has held up well, fit well, and not lost shape over time. Well worth the extra cost.
Agreed. The extra cost is as justified by what they are as by where they're made.
The American Giant t shirts, in Medium for my 40" chest, are cut just tight enough to touch my armpits, which has left excellent deodorant stains after two years of use. My tri blend American Apparel custom ink startup shirts never had armpit stains after a decade of service, in one case. This is a disappointing turn of events, because it means my Gustin polos (in large) will inevitably suffer the same fate.
Meh. My first AG hoodie's drawstring grommets popped off within a month or two. They sent me a new one FOC and didn't ask for the jacked up one back, which was fair I guess. The cuffs are pretty worn out on the first one, the 2nd is not far behind because it doesn't get worn as much. I'm down to one AG long sleeve t-shirt because of the same disintegrating cuff issue and generally wearing out. I'm not hard on my clothes, but these were going on a decade of use. I just bought a trio of Chinese (bleh) long sleeves from True Classic just to replace my other soon to be crapped out winter shirts.
I've had some pretty good luck lately at my Goodwill & indie thrift store so I'm gonna roll with them for a while. I scored a Tektronix 2215 scope for $39 too!
missing grommets: annoying
missing Gromit: tragedy
Tektronix. There’s a name I haven’t heard in a long long time. Spent many an hour in front of a Tektronix display tube.
Back in the 80’s my older brother worked for Sundstrand. They sold off a bunch of their old test equipment and I was able to buy a giant Tektronix o-scope with my lawn mowing money. Smelled like years of cigarettes when you turned it on.
I like the MOAB a lot, thank you for the comparison and heads up! I have a nice collection of Dearborn Denim now after you brought them to my attention a few years back, but recently needed a pair of khakis in a specific shade for a trade show uniform (yeah, I know... the things we do to feed our children), and did you know Amazon Basics has clothing now? 25 fiat bucks and 8 hours of delivery later and they are... fine? After the show they are now my go to change the oil/clear brush pants, it's what they deserve and I don't care what happens to them. I'll grab the MOAB to wear as 'nice' pants.
How is the sizing/fit thru the hips and thighs compared to Levi's 550 relaxed jeans?
I truly don't know. I haven't bought a pair of Levi's since they went overseas before the turn of the century...
...it occurs to me that I find myself using that phrase more and more often, "The turn of the century".
This is not a good sign. Hours ago I used turn-of-the-century in a convetsation, and I'm in the younger generation!
Their last domestic factory - which was located in my hometown - closed in 2002.
Think I sent you an email on the topic last week.
Have you thought of circulating a petition to make it a festive holiday for all to celebrate?
I thought of you earlier.
I smoked a cigar this evening with a new friend who works for McKinsey (just finished his MBA at Booth); he is in town working on / facilitating a substantial M&A deal in the payments space.
He told me he felt a bit apprehensive in his previous assignment / engagement: Helping a midwestern factory lay off some dead weight. He told me that he was probably one of the only people in history to have worn steel-toed boots (they dress as the client does, to fit in) while also wearing a Lange 1 - https://www.alange-soehne.com/us-en/timepieces/lange-1/lange-1
Sherman, so sorry you friend felt apprehensive wearing $44,000 watch while he worked to end someone’s livelihood. You should maybe tell your friend he should maybe stop by the mall and pick up a Timex for such occasions.
"I thought of you earlier...lay off...dead weight."
Classy.
Was your friend at McKinsey long enough to work the Sackler account?
No, he’s only 26.
McKinsey is evil. We should deport the entire company along with the MI-13 thugs to some hell hole far far away.
Was he laughing as he spoke of the boots? That would really be the cherry on this heinous story.
Bear in mind: The owner of the factory hired McKinsey to harvest cost savings; he works for McKinsey; that was his job. McKinsey got paid a portion of the efficiencies they identified.
Just saw my new buddy a moment ago. He had hoped that his next assignment - to begin next month - would be in London, but now it’s looking like he’ll be stuck in Peoria, IL. He whined that he’s trading a glorious summer of long lunches at Scott’s in Mayfair with ready access to the world’s best cigar lounges for Golden Corral. I helpfully reminded him that his steel-toed boots will get some more mileage!
Are all your friends twats?
I have a diverse group of friends!
This is what Dana Thomas wrote in her newsletter last week:
“In my book Fashionopolis: The Price of Fast Fashion and the Future of Clothes, I highlight one case to tell the story: Levi’s.
During the 1990s, Levi’s closed all of its US plants, including one in Blue Ridge, Georgia, an Appalachian Mountain town of fourteen hundred, that had been in operation for forty-three years. Levi’s had already laid off 300 at Blue Ridge a year earlier. Now it was giving pink slips to the final 400.
From Fashionopolis:
These were blue-collar jobs. Most workers earned $8 to $14 an hour for such tasks as making belt loops, attaching rivets, and sewing zippers into jeans. Some took home as little as $20,000 a year. But Levi’s made up for the low pay by being a generous member of the community— donating to the hospital, schools, nursing homes, the public library, and Little League teams.
In 2001, it gave $10,000 to the fire department for a new communications system, and each Christmas, it sent small bags of grooming products or a bit of cash to senior citizens at the local health center. Over the years, the company contributed several thousand dollars toward the county’s first mobile defibrillator and helped pay for a Jaws of Life hydraulic rescue tool for car crashes, curling irons for a cosmetology course, and field lights at the stadium. “They’ve just allowed us to have a lot of things we couldn’t have had,” the high school principal, Doug Davenport, said.
That was over. Blue Ridge became an emblem for the economic and social destruction that profit-driven short-term decisions taken in boardrooms—like offshoring—caused in small manufacturing towns across America.”
Link: https://danathomas.substack.com/p/truth-and-consequences
And that stupid former HR VP grifter was probably fine with all that but the whole DEI at Levi’s was a bridge too far.
I emailed Dana Thomas to let her know that my hometown has prospered significantly since Levi’s left town.
There are now “boutique” townhomes around the corner from the former factory location available for as little as $1.35MM.
Ha! My girlfriend recently bought me a t shirt that says “Please be patient, I’m from the 1900’s”
What's crazy is my grandparents were born ~ 1905. A LOT has changed since then.
So the AG are more 'work' and the Origin more 'looks'?
Would that be a fair statement as they both appear well made?
I got the opposite impression from Jack. AG are more expensive and more stylish with the rivets making them slightly less practical if your work involves bumping against stuff.
Yeah. AG is much fancier looking.
Not to be confused with Adriano Goldschmied denim.
Is that a nylon zipper on the Origins? That should automatically disqualify them from the heavy-duty pants category.
Just got back from the men's room and can confirm mine are nylon zipper.
They call it "mil-spec zipper" but AG has a true brass zipper.
Derek Smalls prefers nylon:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAargSCXQaQ
I have had similar experiences with all American clothing recently, where sizing appears to be at random requiring multiple return cycles.
Ugh. That's not good. How hard can it be to get consistent men's clothing sizing??? I can see women's where the sizes are all random.
i have 5 pairs of the same old navy 34x30 pants in the same cut and none are the same length
i have no idea how this happens
Different factories.
Plus, just like children in America, they don’t follow instructions well.
following instructions gets in the way of "make it cheaper"
The good thing about all that child labor is that these kids must think that Americans are a race of giants!
those 8 year olds need to get their shit together then
I also had this experience but didn't bother with a return on a medium polo which is LIKE WEARING A MUMU whereas the M t-shirt is on the too snug size.
A mumu? Are we having fun yet?
https://www.amazon.com/Zippy-Pinhead-Walk-Mile-Muu-Muu-ebook/dp/B01LWJWFZF
By comparison, I have two pairs of Origin jeans and two pairs of shorts purchased years apart. They all fit identically at the waist.
I bought my first pair of American Giant Roughneck pants back before Covid and I've still got them - along with four other pairs. They're suitable for everything short of a dressy occasion (though the black ones will do in a pinch) and the only pants I wear anymore. They're just that comfortable and durable. Can't recommend them more highly.
I've got a pair of CostCo / Kirkland jeans for any dirty work that needs doing.
Congrats on the lack of fat pants photographed!
If any other Baruth chimes in here, it will be to remind me that nobody else in the family needs to go all the way out to 36!
Never in my life has it ever occurred to me to shop for a zipper with curb appeal.
“A zipper with curb appeal” will be my Grindr profile tagline if I ever feel so inclined to join Grindr.
i occasionally wear my dad's 1936 blue pinstripe self-belted cream flannel trousers. they look about a year old. way back when, mom didn't like me wearing his no-lapel pale green seersucker suit so she threw it away around '65
sounds crisp as hell
Seersucker is very comfortable.
I have my Dad’s WWII sailor suit and it still looks brand new.
During One Lap Of America 2006, I wore a Brooks Brothers seersucker suit for the southern leg of the route. This was widely lampooned, and with good reason!
Please, pretty please, post photos…,
It was from an era before phone cameras, so I got NOTHING!
About a year ago, I got an email from brooks brothers about how now "We are a global brand" or "Citizens of the world" type shit. I haven't bought a thing from them since. Of course, now I need new dress shirts and I have no idea what to buy as that was typically my go to brand.
I was in a similar position. Todd Shelton and Gitman both looked to have a good selection of USA-made shirts. Can’t speak to the quality, I ended up switching jobs and no longer need to maintain a closet of “nice” shirts. It’s branded Ogio polos for me now.
There's only one answer to that: Turnbull & Asser.
Going to the Turnbull & Asser website, while I do fine, I do not do Turnbull & Asser money fine.
They wear like iron so you can get away with owning very few of them, that's the magic.
Maybe I'll try my luck with ebay before dropping $600 to test. They're reasonable used.
For anyone who prefers to order by telephone but not quite sure how to go about it, you could use this conversation (5:15, audio only) as model:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dohNFXMHL-I&t=18s
LBJ was not shy about whipping it out in front of people, either.
"A very tiny bit, mind you, which is how we go from denim being genuinely offensive to a lot of people in 1965 to being a wink-and-nod from an establishment pop songwriter."
I was only 10 years old in 1965 but it seems to me that the only place blue jeans could have been considered offensive is if you wore them to weekly religious services, a wedding, or a funeral. In other words, dressing casual for a somewhat formal event. Boys wore blue jeans or other dungarees to school. I have to say, though, that I don't think I ever saw my father or any fathers of my friends ever wearing jeans. People still dressed up to fly and wore suits to baseball games back then.
For daily services I'll wear whatever I have on. For Sabbath services I'll put on a suit. I also wear suits to funerals, unless I'd otherwise miss them. Jewish funerals take place within 24 hours of death, if possible, so sometimes you find out about them at the last minute - I once went to the funeral and burial of a bike riding friend's father in my Lycra riding gear because I found out right after finishing a long ride.
Yeah, this is from 1961, although he is doing chores:
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0512458/mediaviewer/rm3101825793/
Looks like Wally is in Khakis and Beaver in dungarees:
https://thesubtimes.s3.amazonaws.com/uploads/2022/06/Beaver1.jpg
I've heard that Michigan State had a strict dress code that was only relaxed in the late 1970s; this seems to support it:
https://onthebanks.msu.edu/Exhibit/162-567-45/dormitory-life/
during the 1960s, but the rules for dress while eating in the residence halls were as well. The old rule of men being required to wear coats and ties while eating in the dormitory dining halls had been in effect since the end of World War II. Based on a survey from students not finding the old way of dressing all that popular, a new rule was set in place. Male students were now required to wear clean and neat dress slacks (no jeans or shorts), dress shirts (no t-shirts, knit shirts, plaids, or bold stripes), and dress shoes (no slippers, tennis shoes, clogs, or thongs)
I'm pretty sure all that was gone by the time I started at Michigan in 1972. There were no dress codes. I had visited Michigan State before graduating high school because they were recruiting me and so my mom and my dad could visit East Lansing, where they lived while my father attended vet school. I don't recall the kids at State dressing any differently than the kids in Ann Arbor.
By the time I got to Michigan, men were allowed in the Michigan League and women were allowed above the first floor of the Michigan Union.
A lot of things had changed by the end of the '60s. Not all for the good. Not all for the bad.
It was regarding the late 1970s at MSU, and was mentioned because it was remarkable, and I may have even heard it first-hand. Perhaps the person was not being fully truthful.
And yes, 1964-1965 was a year of major change: the "Middle Atlantic accent" was no longer taught, and almost all English-speaking countries radically changed their immigration systems almost simultaneously.
Speaking of change, I recently learned of this and found it sad:
https://www.michigandaily.com/statement/billiards-hall-hustled/
https://www.michigandaily.com/news/community-affairs/community-reacts-exclusion-billiards-hall-union-renovation/
Speaking of kids on tv in the early '60s, Jay North, who played Dennis the Menace, recently passed away.
"The only place blue jeans could have been considered offensive is if you wore them to weekly religious services, a wedding, or a funeral. In other words, dressing casual for a somewhat formal event. Boys wore blue jeans or other dungarees to school. I have to say, though, that I don't think I ever saw my father or any fathers of my friends ever wearing jeans. People still dressed up to fly and wore suits to baseball games back then."
Ronnie, I think you're making my point to say that children wore denim and adults did not.
My mother was once expelled from a country club in Lower Alabama for a dress code violation (denim).
We were at some lake down there for a wooden boat show, and she had the temerity to attempt entry to the clubhouse at 7:45 AM to pick up continental breakfast for her children while wearing jeans.
I'm not disagreeing, but I think "considered inappropriate at times" was closer to the tenor of the time than offensive. Grok says that the jeans Brando wore in The Wild Ones "were a key part of his character's defiant, anti-establishment image". That was in 1953.
Elvis wore jeans in his early movies.
"Jailhouse Rock (1957): Elvis, as Vince Everett, wears blue jeans in scenes that emphasize his rebellious, working-class character, particularly during the iconic "Jailhouse Rock" dance sequence.
King Creole (1958): Playing Danny Fisher, Elvis dons jeans in parts of the film, fitting the gritty, New Orleans street vibe of his character.
G.I. Blues (1960): As Tulsa McLean, Elvis wears jeans in off-duty scenes, aligning with his character's laid-back, youthful persona."
We used to dress up for mass, I wore jeans for Easter mass. My daughters looked cute though.
I did have a lot of "Lady, you are in Church!" thoughts at some of the revealing outfits the teenagers were wearing.